Examining Israel’s ‘Right to Defend Itself’

32 Comments

1. 

   Anon

   November 29, 2012 at 8:09 AM

   The problem with the Israel-Palestine issue is that there are no important stakeholders who are not biased to one side. No one who truly wants to see a lasting, stable solution to this can be described as impartial in any way. Not just because one side will always accuse those who suggest solutions which impact them negatively as “biased”, but simply because anyone who’s saying something about this loud enough to be heard has been blinded by partisanism.

   As a Muslim, I find it discouraging that so many Muslims are blinded by either their hatred of Israel and/or the Jewish people to see that Palestinians are not blameless in this situation.

   (I’m not even going to talk about those who hijack conflicts like this to champion their self-image and proclaim their holier-than-thou personality to anyone dumb enough to fall for it – “O you don’t wanna destroy Israel? – kaafir!. O you’re not going to attend the Free Palestine March #2521012? – Kaafir!” You get the picture…)

   I also find it staggering that so many Muslims are unaware – or choose to ignore – the long, complicated history of Israel, and the many conflicts that have been going on between Arabs and Jews, Muslims and Jews, Muslims and Christians, for centuries in that region of the world. It is simply historically ignorant to keep claiming that the Jews occupying Palestine is the beginning and end of the current crisis. It has a much longer history than that.

   Another disheartening fact is that many Muslims are unaware of the implications of hating an entire people, or wanting them or their nation to be destroyed.

   Some, on the other hand, claim that because Jews are chastised so harshly in the Qur’an and Hadith, hatred of them and desire for their destruction , in their entirety – man, woman and child, is justified, nay sanctioned by Allah. This might sound strange and implausible to some, but for those who have attended even a small amount of Jumu’a Khutbas, thinking about the words of some Khateebs when discussing this matter will lead to this same disturbing conclusion.

   I’m not saying that there is an easy solution to this problem, and in fact I will not even attempt to convey any sort of solution in this comment. I just felt it necessary to point out that Palestinians, but more importantly, the rest of the Muslim Ummah, will never ever solve this problem if they do not acknowledge that the Jews are not to blame for everything, the Palestinians are not completely innocent, the global Muslim Ummah is most definitely not blameless, and any solution to the problem MUST include the safety and right to a separate nation for the Jewish people.

   Reply
   • 

     Gibran

     November 30, 2012 at 11:23 AM

     SubhanAllah?

     Who exactly are you? What your are saying is absolutely revolting.

     Reply
   • 

     Mahmud

     December 1, 2012 at 9:49 PM

     *Comment Removed by Comments Team*

     Dear Mahmud:

     You are MashaAllah an active commentator on our site and we encourage discussion of issues and point of views within the context of our articles. However, this forum is not the place for takfir or to call another Muslim a munafiq. This is in clear violation of our comments policy and repeated comments of this nature will only result in you being banned. As it is you are already on moderation.

     We encourage you to tone down a bit so this forum can be used by you to reason and convince others of your point of view rather than antagonize them.

     Best Regards
     WasSalamuAlaikum
     -Aly

     Reply
     • 

       Anon

       December 2, 2012 at 7:48 AM

       This has not addressed anything in my post. All you have done is obliquely call me a munafiq, and thus dismissed by argument with that. I struggle to see what exactly about my comment betrays my munafiq nature.

       If you read my comment, and summarized it as “siding with the kuffar”, I’m afraid you have completely misunderstood it.

       Reply
     • 

       Mahmud

       December 3, 2012 at 9:35 PM

       Assalamualaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh

       Ghafarallahu lak

       Fear Allah. If you were wrong about accusing me of making takfir, than perhaps you will regret this on Yawm ad Din.

       In any case, Allah is watching how you moderate the comments on this deteriorating site. So be just and balanced, that is closer to taqwa.

       And know when to defend someone as a “Muslim”. Even when they say something like what anon said? SubhanAllah.

       We can settle this before Allah and we will surely see who is right then.

       Reply
       • 

         Aly Balagamwala | DiscoMaulvi

         December 4, 2012 at 12:55 AM

         Dear Mahmud
         WaAlaikum Assalam Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu:

         Every day I perform my duties on this site, I keep Allah in front of me, else I would not be doing this work. It is not just I who “wrongfully accused” you but the person who you accused of being a hypocrite.

         Ultimately you are correct it will be Allah who will decide and so I think you should leave the judgement of who is or is not a hypocrite up to Him.

         With regards to this site being “deteriorating” no one is forcing you to visit, read, and comment.

         Best Regards
         -Aly

         Reply
   • 

     robbie

     December 2, 2012 at 10:23 AM

     Muhammed Abdul

     Words of wisdom, spoken by an educated man!!
     It’s a great shame more people of your faith can not hear your words.
     You obviously care very much about your people, which is honourable, but understand fully the implications of racial hatred.
     I salute your views and respect you for standing up and telling your people the truth about a situation which has run for centuries.

     Reply
   • 

     VJaber

     December 27, 2012 at 3:42 AM

     I am Palestinian and I have many Jewish, and even Israeli, friends so it is very ignorant of you to say that Muslims hate Jews.
     What have to Palestinians done to the Israeli’s, flicked a few dead matches. I believe one Israeli got injured in the latest Gaza conflict while hundreds of Palestinians DIED, innocent civilians, mothers and children. It is very revolting that anyone would defend the Israeli’s right to attack the Palestinians.

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   • 

     Abdurraheem

     March 1, 2013 at 6:56 AM

     You must be either acting like being a muslim or one with poor science or God-fearing. The Quran and sunnah don’t say you have to kill every jew – man, female, child – like you imply. Moreover, whatever Palestinians might have done according to you.. look at the numbers, do thousands of them have to be killed while having nothing to do with this? For me, the lifes of the supporters of that pirate state called ‘Israël’ all deserve to die and be punished right away. You people dont believe in hell, who told you that it doesn’t exist, you invented this lie yourselves.

     Reply
2. 

   Abdus Sabur

   November 29, 2012 at 9:29 AM

   As salamu alaikum,

   Jazak’Allahu khair for writing this article because it has inspired me to delve a little deeper into the hunch I had that Zionism is antithetical to Judiasm because I feel that Zionism is making a mockery of the victims of the holocaust of Nazi Germany. I simply typed in Google “Zionism behind the holocaust?”

   I was surprised to find so much information of documented resources. A good place to start is jewsnotzionism.org

   I urge my brothers and sisters in Islam to read more about this subject because it will shed so much light, insha’Allah, as to what is going on and why.

   Wa salam,
   Abdus Sabur

   Reply
3. 

   Mohammad Abdul

   November 30, 2012 at 5:29 AM

   I think some important facts need to be mentioned in order to apprecaite the Israeli occupation.

   Firstly the whole of Israel is an occupaying force and this occupation started in 1948 when Israel was first declared. No amount of time passed or UN resolutions should change that and we should not accept the narrative which keeps talking about the 1967 boarders, the whole of Israel is an occupation and all of it needs to be reversed.

   Secondly we need to accept that the UN, US and Western governments in general are not honest brokers of this conflict, on the contary it is they who have placed Israel in the heart of the Muslim world (UK did), armed it to the teeth and back it all the way. For people to seek them to sort this conflct out is just navie, the US and all western governments seek only 1 thing, and that is their INTEREST in the region, not right or wrong. So we should not call upon them to solve this problem.

   Lastly the problem in the Muslim world in general is that we do not have any sincere leadership which represents the aspirations and values of the Muslim masses, until we have a government is implements the values and aspirations of Muslims, the Israeli occupation will never be reversed. The only reason Israel occupys the Palestine is because no Muslim leader has the courage to send out the Muslim army to protect the Muslims of Gaza.

   Reply
4. 

   robbie

   December 2, 2012 at 10:47 AM

   Mohammed Abdul

   You had me and now you’ve lost me!!

   You’re obviously well educated, and quite rightly point out that Israel was formed back in 1948.
   The 1967 borders issue, only became an issue, because on the holliest day in the Jewish calender, all the Arab/Muslim surrounding countries launched a joint assault on Israel.

   Now in your previous post, you raised some very valid points about the issue not being a wholly Israel/Jewish fault and equally mentioned that hatred of the Jews is not something that should be followed for the sake of Islam and your Muslim brothers.

   Now you are suggesting to oust the Israeli/ Jewish state altogether after over 60 years of formation, which is a complete about turn on your previous post!!
   Do you really think this would resolve anything!!!

   As for your comments about America, Uk etc, your comments are ridiculous!!
   Do you really think these countries have an anti Muslim policy???
   Just take a look at the amount of your Muslim brothers that have been welcomed to live in these countries with open arms.

   You can’t have it both ways here, come on be reasonable and stop thinking that the world is against Islam.

   Just go back over the last ten years and look at the attrocities that have been comitted, do you really think these acts have done anything good for the image of Islam???

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   • 

     Mohammad Abdul

     December 2, 2012 at 2:04 PM

     robbie
     I have only made 1 comment on this blog and this is my 2nd comment, so i am not sure what your first comment is reffering to, i think you should learn to follow the argument and discussion before commenting that would be advisable.

     My ponit about the US/UK is not that it is anti Muslim rather it is only inetersted in its INTEREST like i mentioned before, hence it should not be seen as a honest broker. It happens to be that its interest conflict with the interest of Muslims in that region and their values. Just because they allow Muslims to come into their country does not mean that they are not against certain Muslim views and values-to suggest otherwise that is riduculous.

     My ponit about Israel is that all of it is an occupation, are you saying it is not, it started in 1948 (fact), that occupation should be reveresed. No amount of time passed or UN resolution will justify it.

     Islam has a bad image because media is unfair towards it and politicians have demonised it, you live in a fairy world if you think otherwise, the more important ponit is that i would rather Islam had a ‘bad image’ and be on the side of good then having a ‘nice image’ like Israel and being on the side of those who oppress, then i can stand in front of my Lord and say that i was on the side of truth against falsehood even though people gave the truth a bad image.

     The real ponit is this-Israel started its occupation in 1948 should we allow it to have that land? what type of message are we sending to the rest of the dictators of the world? That is something for sincere and honest people to think about?

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     • 

       Waleed Ahmed

       December 2, 2012 at 3:31 PM

       thanks for the comment Mohammad. I would have to disagree with one point you make though. If we are carrying the banner of international law and the UN to fight for the rights of Palestinians, we also have to acknowledge that Israel is recognized to be a country founded in 1948 under international law. The occupation, under law, refers to the West Bank, East Jeruslam and Gaza. We aren’t calling for Israel to stop existing as a nation, we are calling for the occupation to end as defined under law. This is also what most Palestinians are calling for under the two-state solution.

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       • 

         Anon

         December 3, 2012 at 1:04 AM

         While it is true that most Palestinians desire a two-state solution, it should not be forgotten that there are some (no names mentioned) who would like to see the war with Israel, and the Jews in general, go on. This is because it provides them with a certain legitimacy, and also, allows them to further push their agendas. Some have even outright said that Israel’s existence is a deal-breaker for them, and that they would like to wipe them off the map.

         Again, this may sound strange to some – even blasphemous or “munafiq” apparently.

         Lest I be misunderstood – there are those on the Israeli side who would love nothing more to continue the war, and even destroy the Palestinian entirely. This is well known amongst Muslims, and sometimes goes to the extent where we falsely accuse Jews who aren’t even Israelis of desiring this. We acknowledge the fasad of Israel. We all know Netanyahu basically despises Palestinians, Arabs, and Islam in general. His predecessor was no better. The moderate Israelis are few and far between when it comes to making their voice heard. The left-leaning ones are even more dangerous, as they pretend to care about Palestinians while hijacking the issue to push their own leftist., irreligious lack-of-moral-standards agenda.

         All I’m saying is that a little introspection from the Muslim side wouldn’t hurt.

         Reply
       • 

         Mohammad Abdul

         December 3, 2012 at 1:40 PM

         Thanks Waleed for responding, I think this is the crux of the discussion, should we accept the framework and parameters set by the international community or not regarding the issue of Palestine? In reality the so called ‘international community’ and UN consists of the global superpowers and their views and solutions. US, UK, Russia, France and China are the permenant members and can veto any resolution they like, nobody else has this right except them, so in origin it is they who dictate what is international law or not, how can it be right for 5 countries to decide the law of the rest of the world, who gave them that authority? And it’s not very international at all. Also these countries have nothing to do with Palestine nor is it an extension of their land, so why should they decide the Resoultion to this conflict? Not to mention that it is some of these countries who estabilished, funded and protected Israel, how can they give a just settlement, I would argue that we should not follow the UN or international law on this or any issue, for they will be bias and the superpowers will veto any resolution which goes against their interest in the region hence these powers are not honest brokers, the real question is- is it possible to solve the problem of Israel without the UN?

         Reply
         • 

           Waleed Ahmed

           December 4, 2012 at 1:09 AM

           yes, we have to work within the parameters of international law. That’s what the Palestinians are trying to do as well. If you read my references to this series, I’ve built this case based on jurisprudence of internationally recognized laws such as the Geneva Conventions, The Apartheid Convention, UN committee on Discrimination etc etc. Since, we are invoking the law to demonstrate that Palestinian rights are being violated, we have to work within this law to carve out a just resolution to the conflict. And yes, this law also states that Israel is a country founded in 1948 and has all the rights of any sovereign nation; as accepted by most Palestinians – this point isn’t up for debate. We can debate the moral legitimacy of the State, but legally we can’t. Also, debating this point is futile as it has no acceptance in global politics and won’t take us anywhere. It’s idealistic, but it’s a waste of our energy and time.
         • 

           Mohammad Abdul

           December 4, 2012 at 7:12 AM

           Waleed

           Why is there an infatuation with international law etc etc, as if these are universal? Quite frankly they are not, it was designed by the super powers of the day to dictate their values and ideals to the rest of the world, why can we not see that? Do you really think Waleed that the US and Europe will allow Muslims to have their own way with the Palestinian issue when it is they who caused the problem and perpetuate the Israeli occupation. Secondly I am not sure how you know all Palestinians want the two state solution? Maybe providing some evidence will be helpful. Lastly, we should not just view this as a national Palestinian issue, rather is this a Muslim and Islamic issue because that is what bind Muslims to that land the fact the Allah (swt) gives Al-Quds an important place in Islam so the really question is what is the Islamic solution to this issue, not the UN, international law etc etc as it should be Islam that dictates to us what needs to happen with this occupation.
     • 

       robbie

       December 3, 2012 at 4:10 AM

       To Muhammed Abdul

       Firstly, my apologies, I confused your views with that of ANON, whom I think should be commended in his honesty and obviously cares deeply about his faith and brotherhood !!

       Secondly I need to tell you “POINT ” is spelt like that, not PONIT !!

       OK, going back to your discussion:
       You are living in Cuckoo land if you think the western world is ANTI MUSLIM. In the UK, one of the top social agendas is to irradicate ANY form of racial hatred, regardless of whether it is aimed at religion or skin colour !!
       Yes, you are quite right to a degree, but it is, ONLY CERTAIN VIEWS from a MINORITY of MUSLIMS that are frowned upon!!
       So to put a question to your views, Can you tell me how the UK or the US benefit from allowing Muslims to enter their countries?? I would also like to point out that in the UK, some Muslim families recieve great welfare payments from the state !!!
       How does this benefit these countries?? I think it also more than fair to point out, that many Muslims moved to these countries to better their own lives for themselves and their families!!!
       I am sure the vast majority would agree, that to move to these countries with real democracy and the right to free speech has been a breath of fresh air !!!

       Now moving on to the rest of your argument, can you tell me how a country that was not in existance before 1948 can be an occupying force???? YOU CAN’T!!!
       The state of ISRAEL was created in 1948 which was under British rule at the time and the land in question was divided. Part became JORDAN ant the other PART became ISRAEL under an international aggreement !!!
       So after this very brief history lesson, can you tell me why these HAMAS/PALESTINIANS are not waging war against JORDAN?????
       With all due respect, I think you should read some of what ANON is saying and learn from someone that obviously cares dearly about his faith and has the interests of his fellow Muslims at heart.

       Wake up and smell the coffee, can you not see in this modern world, it is only the RADICAL BLOOD THIRSTY views that are causing al of these problems for JEWS and MUSLIMS alike.

       I’d be very interested to know what part of the world you live in??

       Reply
       • 

         Mohammad Abdul

         December 3, 2012 at 2:03 PM

         Robbie
         The reason we know that the UK government is against certain Islamic values and Muslims who hold these values is because it has said so in its prevent and contest strategy papers read them for yourself. The UK government explicitly states that if Muslims do not believe in homosexuality, that Israel has a right to exist etc etc (in the paper) they will be labelled extremist and beyond the acceptable values of the government, so the question is why are the government targeting Islamic values only. Also in the RAND corporation report which governments in the West have adopted it clearly states that western governments should fund those Muslims who are in agreement with the government agenda against perceived radicals who do not tow government lines, how is that not causing division within a community, setting it against each other (traditional divide and conquer). Your nonsense about Muslims receiving welfare as if that is good treatment is absurd simply because all citizens of UK receive it, does that mean the government is treating everyone well? Muslims made mass migration to Europe for two reasons 1. because of western colonialism and the havoc it caused around the world including Muslim lands and 2. because Europe needed migrant workers to build up their countries again after WW1 and 2 – so do not try and play this we welcomed you in out of the generosity of our heart nonsense, western governments allowed mass migration because it benefitted them as it did those who migrated.

         Now as for the Palestine issue, the fact that Israel was not in existence and then came into existence, who’s land do u think it took in 1948-your deluded enough to think that Transjordan at that time was empty, that Israel walked into an empty land, maybe you should check your history. Palestine was under British mandate, which was handed to the Zionist (not Jewish faith) movement, Britain itself was an occupying force, so 1 occupier handed it to another occupier, the hypocrisy is disgusting. As for international agreement about Israel, read my comment to waleed.

         It’s amazing how people want to forget how a whole people were slaughtered, displaced and then talk about Blood thirty views.

         Also thanks for the spelling correction.

         Reply
         • 

           Robbie

           December 7, 2012 at 11:36 AM

           Muhammad Abdul

           Please do not feel the need to thank me for correcting your spelling mistakes!!

           Now, you really don’t need to tell me about my own countries current legislation.
           I noticed however, you refrained from answering any of the questions I gave to you!!

           Anyway, as a westerner, if I visited a MUSLIM country, I would respect the country and their people and dress accordingly, to avoid upsetting the local community. This decision, would be made purely out of RESPECT, and for the same reason other countries views, should be respected by MUSLIMS in countries that they visit or live!!
           We have a saying here “When in Rome, do as the Romans do”
           Now onto your next statement which I have copied part of to refresh your mind “Muslims do not believe in homosexuality, that Israel has a right to exist etc etc”
           Not believing in one thing is fine!!
           But to encourage the eradication/destruction of another country is nothing more than RACIAL HATRED, so yes, we in the Western World will not accept this type of attitude!!
           I might also point out, that in the UK it is considered an offence to abuse HOMOSEXUAL people, be it by Muslims, Jews or Nutcase Nazi skinheads.
           Next, you are quite right, many Muslims did move to the UK because of Colonialism and the offer of Jobs, but nobody forced them to come here kicking and screaming!! Also, as I pointed out in my last mail to you, the majority of whom are very happy in the West and don’t follow your radical views!!
           Yes, WE DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH RADICAL TERRORISM and ENCOURAGING RACIAL HATRED of any form!!
           Hey, do you want me to show you what was in these lands we are discussing PRE 1948 on this web site?? If I do, your argument will be weakened massively as it was a land which basically was a desert, and after all, according to Hamas’s recent views, they are only interested in the WEST BANK!! wHICH WAS 100% DESERT.
           Also, you mentioned JORDAN, but chose to avoid the question I asked, which was ” Why are these HAMAS/PALESTINIAN MILITANTS not waging war on JORDAN????
           Can I tell you, JORDAN refused point blank to take any of these PALESTINIANS into its country and in fact EJECTED some who did enter!!
           Now, again I am sorry to burst your Bubble, but prior to the British control of these lands, the land in question was under the Greater Syria boundaries which were under rule from the Ottoman Empire!!
           After the fall of the Ottoman Empire these lands were split between England, France and Spain.
           It was only in 1967 sometime after the formation of Israel that any one even heard about these uprooted Palestinians, so check factual history before writing.
           Also, if you want to go back further, I sure ever reader here has heard about the ISRAELITES?? Yes, well you are going back to around 12BC, when talking about these people in these lands !!!
           Oh, Syria also now own some of the old so called Palestine, so agian, why no issues with them ??

           Really, history will not help you with your argument.

           Now, your final contradicting comment:
           “It’s amazing how people want to forget how a whole people were slaughtered, displaced and then talk about Blood thirty views.”
           Haha, so if these people were all slaughtered as you suggest above, the new so called PALESTINIANS must be fakes and only interested in the destruction of Israel and Judaism !!! NO ARGUMENT after quoting your own words!!

           You know, if you want to have a debate, don’t come to the table with a load of cods whallop.

           Learn to LIVE AND LET LIVE
         • 

           Robbie

           January 10, 2013 at 11:10 AM

           Muhammad Abdul

           Well I have waited for quite some time for a response to my final reply to you and just as I thought, you have disappeared !!

           I take it you have thoroughly checked my comments and found them to be 100% correct, hence the no reply.

           Case Dismissed
5. 

   Mahmud

   December 2, 2012 at 2:19 PM

   Assalamualaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh

   Israel has as much right to defend itself as a theif does when withholding what he stole.

   No, less than that.

   Reply
6. 

   Yochanan

   December 3, 2012 at 7:36 PM

   When does the time period when something is stolen run out? Rome Stole it from the Jews in 70 AD and the annals of the Assyrian king Sennacherib – declare that he tried to steal it from them in 721 BC. He named Hezekiah the Judite by name. There is no dispute that they were there.

   Logic and historical evidence does not work very well in the Muslim mind, does it? I find the same thing with Christians. Reality totally ignored.

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7. 

   Rachel

   December 23, 2012 at 1:37 PM

   Every time that a woman is stoned to death, or a woman or girl is murdered in an “honor killing” [an oxymoron for sure], or girls are subjected to clitoridectomies, or “given” in marriage barely out of diapers, the world’s view of moslems is lowered from respect toward rejection. When moslem religious leaders declare that marrying young girls who have not even lost their milk teeth is perfectly OK, the world feels shame, even revulsion for Islam. When homosexuals are killed but all know what goes on in madrases behind closed doors, there is more contempt.

   There is the issue of Israel. And first I must thank all the writers who use “Israel” in their writing instead of teh Zionist regime or Occupier or other derogatory language of rejection. You have claimed that Israel has recently attacked Gaza without any cause! What utter nonsense! You writers blithely ignore that Gazans had been lobbing rockets into Israel on a daily basis adding up to THOUSANDS of rockets over many months culminating in a daily barrage of hundreds of rockets daily that Israel finally responded to by bombing right back. Why were the deaths so disproportionate??? Why so few deaths of Israels and so many more of Gazans? Because the Israelis love their children and build bomb shelters everywhere, in every house and school. The Palestinians do NOT spend money on protecting their people; they do NOT build shelters for their children; they choose to spend the money on expensive rockets, bombs & other materiel which they launch FROM schools, FROM hospitals, FROM sports fields, FROM domiciles, so as to force Israel to destroy the launch sites IN SPITE of the presence of civilians. It is well known IN Gaza that the Israelis warned civilians, even with cell phone messages & dropping leaflets that they were about to bomb so leave the area ASAP. The leaders in Gaza know very well how to protect their sorry selves – by surrounding themselves with little children when they show themselves in public, like Mashaal.

   Allow me to remind you of some truths about the Palestinians. The recent withholding of tax money from Israel to the PA? That was to repay Israel for the electricity bills totaling many months the PA has not paid! Do any of you care that the PA extorts money from their own subjects, from the slaries they earn in Israel or their retirement pensions, and will beat or even kill if they don’t get the money? These are Mafia actions not actions of a legitimate government.

   Do you care that the Palestinians have an unfortunately duplicitous habit of thanking the Israelis by killing or trying to kill them? For example a candy distributor who trusted his long term Palestinian customers until they killed him during a delivery one day, or a gardener who killed his employer when she became too poor to employ him any longer, or a young woman would-be suicide bomber coming to hospital with a bomb belt strapped around her stomach in order to kill the doctors and nurses who were treating her for many months gratis for her severe burns. And an equally appalling habit of sneaking into Jewish homes at night and cutting the throats of sleeping babies and children.

   In order to support the Palestinian cause here and now as well as in the past, one must blind oneself to many inconvenient truths and instead manufacture lies about the adversaries.

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   • 

     Khan G

     January 1, 2013 at 2:36 AM

     [This is a reply to the post that claims supporting the Palestinian cause is self blinding, and fabricating lies about the adversaries.] Sorry I do not know your name. I read your post carefully.As far as I can see, your perspective is either biased, therefore subjective, or very ill-informed. I will choose the latter, since our prophet would choose where there is hope.

     There are many more, but I am compelled to limit my post to two points as I am preparing for an important exam. I promise though(God willing) I will make them all in the near future.

     The first is simply putting two things together: by your logic, the 138 countries that supported the latest Palestinian bid to become an observer state ” blind oneself to many inconvenient truths and instead manufacture lies about the adversaries” (sic). I do not think there is a need for a reminder that it was the same UN that legalized Israel in 1948. So it is either they were wrong then, or they are right now.

     The second point: We Muslims know Israel as a great Prophet Jacob. So the reason we call the Jewish State( as Netenyahu calls it) ‘ the zionist regime’ or ‘ occupier’ is the need to separate the clean name of Jacob( according to our belief of course) from an apartheid regime/. By the way, I do not think ‘Zionist Regime’ is derogatory, or else Israeli ideologues would not have use it.

     I will stop here, but I will be back.

     Peace upon those who adhere to the Truth.

     Reply
8. 

   Abdul Haqq

   December 24, 2012 at 9:48 PM

   http://ifamericansknew.org/

   Reply
9. 

   Rachel

   December 26, 2012 at 4:35 AM

   You ought to know that I have lived close to & worked closely with Moslems from numerous countries for over 30 years. As individuals I have great respect for them but when it comes to any government that Moslems control, they are disasters with darn few freedoms of any kind plus devolution into medieval fear & violence. How many workers were just killed in Pakistan for trying to get kids vaccinated against polio? I have been to Iran; the Iran of today is a bastion of fear & hatred when it used to be a highly respected educated country. I have been to Afghanistan BEFORE the Buddha statues were destroyed, even back then girls outside the few privileged were never taught to read. I could go on & on. None of the deterioration & substitution of rage for reason is due to anything OUTSIDE Islam.

   Reply
   • 

     Robbie

     January 2, 2013 at 12:37 PM

     Very Well Spoken Rachel.

     You, I and a handful of other MM readers understand fully the situation with regards to Israel.
     Hamas, is nothing more than a Terrorist Organization that use force and bully tactics to try and achieve their goal.

     Quickly in response to the Khan G post.don’t use the fact that 138 countries have agreed to “the observer state” as a way of trying to say they are not Terrorists!!!
     I am quite sure this decision was made in the interest of saving lives, which is honorable, but as Rachel stated, it is a damned shame, these militant fanatics, don’t share the same caring for their brothers as we infidels!!!!

     Reply
10. 

    Rachel

    December 27, 2012 at 9:51 AM

    As of 12/27, neither Abdul Haqq nor anyone else has responded to my remarks. Abdul Haqq’s link has no relevance to the vast majority of what I have raised that distresses me even if these issues do not move any of you.
    So let me throw out to you a simple question, since up to now, all the commenters are guys, do any of you know a moslem family in which the wives have never been beaten by their husbands? Because I do not.

    Reply
    • 

      Aly Balagamwala | DiscoMaulvi

      December 28, 2012 at 2:19 AM

      Dear Rachel

      Alhamdulillah (all praises are due to Allah) there has been no cases of spousal abuse in my entire family all of whom are Muslims. Considering there are around 2 billion muslims do you seriously think you can generalize based on the handful families you may know or may have read about it the media?

      What relevance spousal abuse has to Israel/Palestine issue eludes me though.

      Regards
      -Aly
      *Disclaimer: The above comment is made in a personal capacity and not as a member of the MM Comments Team*

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11. 

    Joybringer

    February 11, 2013 at 4:56 AM

    I appreciate the efforts of the many Jews and Palestinians who’ve been praying for peace in the Middle East .This is exactly what the Bible and Quran preach.However, peace-making does involve making concessions; to call Jews death-deserving and Palestinian muslims paradise-deserving has not helped matters since 1948…neither has it worked vice versa….The crux of the matter is that these two cultures need to move forward ,the past notwithstanding: I propose a starting point here…THAT EACH OF THESE PEOPLES HOLD A JOINT RECONCILIATION CONFERENCE WHERE THEY WILL RESOLVE TO ABANDON EVERY RELIGIOUS DOCTRINE THAT PREACHES THE DESTRUCTION OF THEIR NEIGHBOUR. That’s just for starters! Long speeches about Apartheid ,colonisation ,South Africa ..etc. will not help ..for every country in the world has been colonised at one point or another…and most have BEEN LIBERATED and moved on.The fate of men is in the hands of God so any more talk of the past just undermines peacemaking…and smacks of BITTERNESS…which is a sin in both Islam, Judaism and even in Christianity!

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