Politics
How Could Any Muslim Want to Vote for McCain After This?
I believe the following videos (hat-tip to Br. Abdullah’s email for pointing me to this post on Huff-Po) say so much more about the kind of campaign and the kind of voters that McCain is courting than anything the candidates could have said. While you see diversity among Obama supporters, what diversity do you see here? How would you, as a Muslim, felt being in line with these bigots?
I am sorry folks, but the Republican party has gone the good ole’ boys way. It does not represent you, or for that matter any non-white, non-“Judea-Christian” follower. And you would have to be an uncle-tom or pretend to be one, in order to be part of this crowd. Or you could be a principled voter (as I believe Br. Mohamed is) and side with Republicans, but let me warn you— you will be REALLY, REALLY lonely.
If Obama is a terrorist because of some historical links to Muslims, then what does that make of us, everyday Muslims?
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So, I say, without reservations: Vote Obama, Vote Democrat! There is no question which party and candidate is better (or to make it palatable to more people, the lesser of the two evils).
By the way, there are many picture like this one, showing Obama as a communist, terrorist, etc. Goes beyond the pale of human decency and fairness.
[youtube KjxzmaXAg9E]
[youtube itEucdhf4Us]
See Also
- Great article, again making my point much more effectively than I did: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama
- John Lewis, invoking George Wallace, says McCain and Palin ‘playing with fire’
- Raw anger in McCain’s crowds as Obama strengthens
- Panic attacks: Voters unload at GOP rallies
Keep supporting MuslimMatters for the sake of Allah
Alhamdulillah, we're at over 850 supporters. Help us get to 900 supporters this month. All it takes is a small gift from a reader like you to keep us going, for just $2 / month.
The Prophet (SAW) has taught us the best of deeds are those that done consistently, even if they are small. Click here to support MuslimMatters with a monthly donation of $2 per month. Set it and collect blessings from Allah (swt) for the khayr you're supporting without thinking about it.
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Hassan
October 9, 2008 at 10:27 PM
So you are saying guilt by association is wrong, and then you are saying do not vote McCain because of these people (whom he is not directly associated with)?
BTW if McCain is spending time on islamophobes and racists, then he is idiot, as those people would are going to vote for him anyways, he needs to spend time on independents and non-racist people.
Amad
October 9, 2008 at 10:29 PM
Mccain/Palin are COURTING these people.
And the truth of the matters is the republican voters are composed by a vast majority of a very homogeneous group of people. That is a fact, it is not a matter of guilt by association. If you can’t even feel comfortable going to a rally with the supporters, how could you feel comfortable voting for this guy?
Abu Bakr
October 9, 2008 at 11:13 PM
To be fair, even if Ron Paul were the Republican candidate, these people would still vote for him, and they would still be saying Obama is a terrorist, McCain smear campaign or not.
Most of the Southern states were solid Democratic states ever since the Civil War. For Southerners, the Republican party was always the party of Lincoln. That is, until, the 1960’s. After Kennedy, a New England Democrat, ended segregation by force, the Republican party for the first time in a century was able to make a place for itself in the South. “Dixiecrats” like Strom Thurmond, who ran for president on a pro-segregation platform, eventually switched to the Republican party.
The rest is history.
average american muslim
October 9, 2008 at 11:46 PM
its sad to know that this type of ideology exists. may Allah protect us all. AMEEN
some idiot from the video: “ofcourse obama is a terrorist, he is a mozlem”
JDsg
October 9, 2008 at 11:55 PM
What follows is a comment I posted just a little while ago on Tariq Nelson‘s blog (and have also posted on Street Prophets):
The racists and bigots never went away in America, they just went underground. These are the people for whom the right fights the culture wars. The president /does/ represent /a/ true side of Americans, one of several true sides. McCain/Palin is a last gasp to keep that coalition in power four more years. But, IMO, that base – as substantial as it is – is too small to win a national election based on the campaign being run at this time and the economic conditions as they are. You have to attract the center, and McCain’s campaign isn’t doing that.
h.ahmed
October 10, 2008 at 12:11 AM
there are few bigger obama fans than me out there, but even i think this post is unfair.
there probably are hardcore left wing athiest who speak ill of religion, (including Islam), and denounce a belief in God, and view all religious people as deluded nut jobs, etc. – yet they all probably support Obama.
We should be careful of linking people together by people who support them. John McCain was a decent dude (at least up until about 2 years ago. However i dont know anything about Palin – she seems pretty out there…. lol. – but honestly, shes just dumb…
I believe now, the republicans are getting desperate and realize their only shot at winning this election is riling up ‘their base’ and use fear mongering and guilt by association against obama – and thats what their doing now. Inshallah none of this will work, and its too late. Its only idiots like those in those youtube clips who are already racist and stupid who will be affected by this nonsense. I just hope the smarter undecided people/republicans see how vile and disgusting these attack ads are – and then they too will realize that Obama is the clear choice!
I just cant wait to see the look on these people’s faces come November 5th when they have a black mozlem terrorist president :) (inshaAllah)
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 12:34 AM
Do you think a Muslim sister with hijab feel safe, let alone comfortable in this crowd? That’s what a sister posted as s comment on a cross-post of this on dailykos. The same is not true in Obama rallies. There is a difference. Its like going to NASCAR vs. going to a six-flags. And the McCain campaign is actively courting these kind of people based on their campaign of fear.
SaqibSaab
October 10, 2008 at 1:05 AM
lol… “Barama.” That’s a good one. I hope “Barama” wins so this crowd can deal with some good ol’ epic fail for a good 4 years.
sincethestorm
October 10, 2008 at 3:26 AM
I think its dangerous to start stereotyping. Not all whites in the South are racist. Just like not all Muslims are terrorist. There are some people who are drawn to the Republican party…and they happen to be racist.
I’d actually like Primetime to do a undercover report on a muslim sister in hijab going to a Republican rally…and this sister has to be a vocal supporter of McCain. Her attire full of patriotic colors..maybe an American flag as a hijab with a McCain button. I’d pay good money to see the crowd’s reaction.
Ibn Fellah
October 10, 2008 at 3:53 AM
commie faggots?
Obama Muslim?
Obama Terrorist?
European socialists?
Aha, I see the logical connection now!
AbuAbdAllah, the Houstonian
October 10, 2008 at 4:53 AM
bismillah. this just in from Houston: an attorney friend of mine told me that a group of Pakistani-Americans for McCain is fundraising here and educating voters why not to vote for Obama. :)
nope, elvis-sahib has not left the building quite yet. i think he’s just adding chaat masala to his banana and peanut butter sandwiches…
that barack as che poster rocks. :) ¡viva la revolucion!
Al Iskandarani
October 10, 2008 at 7:23 AM
The second video was shot at a rally by my university. I say this to underscore the point that we ALL know these people. Maybe they are not our closest friends, or the people we hang out with on a regular basis, but they may be our co-workers or local store owners.
The sentiments expressed in the videos are not exclusive to the backwoods of America; they are more widespread and, yes, “mainstream” then we would like to think. Makes you wonder how much supposed progress we’ve really made in race relations since the sixties.
MR
October 10, 2008 at 9:41 AM
Where is Mohamed Elbiary?
ibnabeeomar
October 10, 2008 at 10:59 AM
mccains pastor: US should destroy islam
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080526/rod_video
Azra
October 10, 2008 at 11:37 AM
Bismillah. I’m not really into politics, but this whole McCain/Obama issue reminded me of the time when the leaders of Quraish got together to discuss how to sabotage the Prophet (S) before he could emigrate to Madinah. Sh. Abdulbary Yahya mentioned in the Shephard’s Path that their meeting was so important that they could not even let Abu Lahab, the Prophet’s (S) uncle, join the meeting because, even though he was one of the most hostile of the kuffar towards Muhammad (S), he was STILL HIS RELATIVE. The Quraish were afraid that since they share the same blood, there is a tiny, remote chance that Abu Lahab may slightly sway to the side of his nephew and the Quraish could NOT allow any such possibility to exist. In other words, the Quraish perceived Abu Lahab’s blood connection to the Prophet (S) as stronger than the severe hostility he showed towards Muhammad (S) and his followers.
Similarly, I feel that even though Obama seems to have a fair chance against McCain, his perceived connection with Muslims/terrorists due to his name and background will be enough to override all other “positive” traits.
Wallahu A’lam
Farhan
October 10, 2008 at 11:56 AM
I am going to vote Obama, that’s for sure. But, let me explain why I considered McCain.
First, because I do not think McCain is significantly better than Obama in terms of getting us out of Iraq. Actually, Obama, in my opinion, seems to over-compensate for the fact that he is a Democrat and that Democrats are seen as “soft on foreign policy”.
Second, because Obama is VERY VERY economically left-wing. I hate socialism. It is evil.
But rest assured, I’m voting for Shaykh Hussein.
amad
October 10, 2008 at 12:11 PM
Yes, Azra, I really wonder if the average Joe will be able to pull the trigger for Obama on election day. It is one thing to talk, but its another to walk the talk. Americans have gone very far in race relations, but there is still a significant chunk of people, among Democrats and Independents, who won’t be able to overcome past prejudices to vote for a black man. This is a test for the nation. Let’s see how it fares.
Ahmad AlFarsi
October 10, 2008 at 12:36 PM
more rage and anger at mccain events:
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/10/10/henry.mccain.angry.crowds.cnn
… at this rate, it seems like there are going to be nationwide riots if obama wins… if that does happen, may Allah protect the Muslims from these wackos. aameen.
mulsimah
October 10, 2008 at 12:57 PM
salaam
well its not about just getting votes from islamaphobics and islamhaters . the tactic is fear mongering. its too put fear in the average american. I think thats just very very low.
the only reason people say they want to vote for mcain is bc of experience will if soething happnes to him then palin has no experience!
and biden does.
also the pak group in houston. i just feel really sorry for them. they are misinformed. i know some pakis are scared bc obama tends to mention going to pak very openly . he is just str8forward. while mcain will do the same infact God knows how many other countries he want s to go to. also th epak group jsut makes me so mad..i mean mcain did not even vote for habeas corpus for the detainees! while obama personally has been helping guantanamo lawyers.
Mezba
October 10, 2008 at 1:20 PM
Happy to see people are not commenting here on the ridiculous notion of “why voting is haram”.
If you don’t vote, how DO you change the direction of the leadership.
Baraka at Rickshaw Diaries has a great post on Obama (be sure to read the comments section and her reply to one such person who berates her for voting).
Siraaj
October 10, 2008 at 1:37 PM
I have to agree – guilt by association is not a good tactic. It’s the same used against us by nonMuslims – here are their crazies, let’s show them on the media, that means they’re all crazies, and the religion teaches it. We complain about it, we ought not to be the first to use it as a weapon against others, even if we disagree with them.
Siraaj
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 2:32 PM
I have tried to explain what I meant with my post. These people, in lines up in the Northeast and not far below (not the southern bible belt) are saying something that they have gotten from McCain campaign talking points, implicitly or explicitly. Have we heard McCain/Palin condemn such statements? Have we seen McCain/Palin distance themselves away from such hate? No, instead the campaign is feeding personal smears. We know that, everyone knows that.
That is the distance between guilt by unwilling association, and guilt by willing association. They are not the same, even if 3 of the 4 words are the same.
And I repeat this again… how do we discount the question by the Muslim sister who said she would be afraid and unwilling to be ever in a McCain rally… I am sorry, if it was one or two people, that is one thing. But it seems that a large section of the McCain crowd (which is very obviously homogeneous as one can tell) feed and believe in this intolerance.
When McCain/Palin denounce such supporters ,when they stop feeding the frenzy, I’ll be the first in line to disassociate them from their guilt of willing association.
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 2:40 PM
People are demanding more hatred.
Coincidence? Or deliberate fear-mongering?
Panic attacks: Voters unload at GOP rallies
AnonyMouse
October 10, 2008 at 3:38 PM
Call me cynical, but after reading all the articles on the election and what it could/ does mean for the Muslims… seriously, do you REALLY think there’s going to be a notable difference of action regarding Muslims by the government by the next administration compared to the current one?
Although “choosing the lesser of two evils” is mentioned a lot of the time in reference to voting in the election, the way I see it – admittedly as a relatively ignorant outsider – is that both are evil in equal measure, just in slightly different ways.
Haven’t we learned our lessons yet? Politicians say lots of things before the elections, but after the elections the government continues to do incredibly stupid things that harm the country (and whichever countries they decide to attack) more than they do anything helpful or beneficial.
h. ahmed
October 10, 2008 at 4:27 PM
Yes – there can be a notable difference inshaAllah. Inshallah Obama will immediately close Gitmo and other secret prisons, and finally end the war in Iraq!!!
But to make a difference, it takes people to get involved and not just sit on the sideline and watch and complain.
We already have two muslim congressmen in the US Congress. One of them, Keith Ellison, has vowed to personally talk to anyone in the US congress or senate who says anything offensive against Islam/Muslims – and set them straight. He is a devout Muslim and is doing his best to further the causes he believes is more just. We need more people to get involved and support such like-minded people who care about our interests.
However, if we fail to get involved, let alone even vote, why should our government even care about us or our interests?
If you are going to just let people like Bush, Cheyney, – now McCain/Palin and other neocons get into office – (i.e. not vote for the opposition) – then u have indirectly supported them getting into power!
Hassan
October 10, 2008 at 4:42 PM
Bush would close gitmo before leaving, if not, McCain would surely do so as well.
Your last statement is very very wrong. Tomorrow you would say, if people voted for Ralph Nader (for example), they have voted for killing of muslims. as their vote costed Obama election etc.
You know its ok to support one person, (like Amad wants to vote for Obama, thinking lesser of evil), but it is other thing to be fanatic about him.
Siraaj
October 10, 2008 at 5:18 PM
Their campaign is focusing on personal smears as it relates to Bill Ayers and other notable characters in Obama’s life. They’re also raising the issue of the ACORN group. Beyond that, the rest is just the spread of misinformation among uneducated wankers.
Siraaj
h. ahmed
October 10, 2008 at 5:25 PM
I would never say that. I actually respect those who support Nader (in blue states at least), lol, if ur un ohio, florida, etc – VOTE OBAMA!
and im not ‘fanataical’ about obama – by any means. Please dont judge me. :) However there is a lot i do respect and like about obama, and i will vote for him iA.
Hassan
October 10, 2008 at 5:32 PM
Well you posted quite many comments defending him, so I thought you are crazy about him. Anyway even if muslims vote third party candidate in swing states, we should not be holding them responsible for genocide
BTW interesting news:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081010/ap_on_el_pr/osama_ballot
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 5:37 PM
Mouse, u’ve said this before, so let me test your cynicism :)
Do you or anyone else really believe that a Gore presidency would have been the same as the 8 disastrous Bush years? If your answer is no, then that is the proof in the pudding. Choice does matter. We make the best choice possible based on available data and then leave it up to Allah.
Siraaj, “palling around with terrorists” is a dishonest statement and there is a very small logical leap that if he hangs out with terrorists, then he must be one. It is the planting of these smear seeds that blossom into open bigotry on display at the ralliesm
Hassan
October 10, 2008 at 5:40 PM
Perhaps yes. Perhaps no. Only Allah knows if the thing would have happened differently, then what would be outcome. May be Bush presidency was best thing to happen to muslims? Who knows.
ruth nasrullah
October 10, 2008 at 6:12 PM
If any students out there want to do an extra credit paper on propaganda, the McPalin campaign is the perfect case study http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda#Techniques .
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 6:30 PM
Of course only Allah knows. But you know what I mean. Looking back, I am sure many, many Muslims are ruing their decision to vote for Bush in 2000. We believe it was a mistake. So, if it was a mistake, then that means we feel that things would have been better with Gore.
Abu Noor Al-Irlandee
October 10, 2008 at 7:31 PM
Amad, but if you buy the Muslim claim that Muslim votes in Florida were a big contributor to his victory, then your argument actually works against you…if the Muslims would not have voted in 2000 things would have worked out better.
Hassan, I don’t understand your claim that Bush “would” close Guantanamo before the election. What is stopping him that is suddenly going to change. You realize he is fighting with everything he has to prevent even the Uighur detainees, admitted by all to not be terrorists from being released?
At the same time h. ahmed, I know Obama has said he will close Guantanamo (actually McCain has also and even Bush has made similar vague claims about wanting to close it) but do you really believe Obama will “immediately close Gitmo and other secret prisons”? Do you expect him to just release the detainees? I hope and pray he does, and we should all be prepared to demand that he does and to demonstrate in whatever way we can to try to accomplish this, but I don’t predict it happening.
Even though Guantanamo is somewhat unique as a symbol of the injustice of the Bush regime, the focus on it is potentially counterproductive. As you mention there are many more thousands of Muslims in secret U.S. prisons in Iraq, Afghanistan and all over the world and pretending that closing Guantanamo would suddenly solve all the problems is obviously not true.
Also, Obama in no way will completely end the war in Iraq….there is no doubt there will be U.S. troops in Iraq four years from now regardless of who wins. You’re right that he may withdraw more than McCain, but if you believe him, he’ll send them to Afghanistan and Pakistan. As AngryArab (As’ad Abu Khalil) says you can vote for a surge in Iraq (McCain) or a surge in Afghanistan (Obama) the choice is yours.
Obama is better than McCain in a lot of ways (and I’m sympathetic to Amad’s point that you have to realize the general vibe of supporters that each candidate attracts and realize that it’s hard to imagine any Muslim that would feel more comfortable around McCain supporters than Obama supporters — and there’s no reason one should ignore this reality.) still especially when it comes to foreign policy one should not exaggerate the differences between the two parties and one should realize that there is a broad mainstream consensus and any President cannot operate outside of those narrow parameters. It is absolutely obscene and repulsive that in our current situation Obama talks about raising military spending, but that’s what he does.
Allaah knows best.
Amad
October 10, 2008 at 7:33 PM
To McCain’s credit, he is finally speaking up:
But still not doing enough:
And to prove my ultimate point in the post:
Story here: Raw anger in McCain’s crowds as Obama strengthens
Asim
October 11, 2008 at 1:10 AM
Assalam u alaikum,
Has anyone attended a Republican Candidate’s Rally or meeting? I have with my wife (a hijabi) and will post my feelings after I have heard back from some. Please do mention whose rally or meetings you have attended and when.
Thanx.
Asim
AnonyMouse
October 11, 2008 at 1:21 AM
It wouldn’t’ve been the same, but I’m 100% confident that he would’ve been able to muck up the country (and others) just as badly, if not in the same way… Americans have a knack of doing that, it seems :)
AbuAbdAllah, the Houstonian
October 11, 2008 at 4:40 AM
bismillah. anyone who does not understand how Muslims in America can support one candidate or another, would likely say something similar about virtually any group of Americans. “how can they be so dumb?”
speaking as one of the “dumb” (but not mute, and inshaAllah not “dhumb” either), i cast my first vote in a Presidential election in a Democratic primary in Texas. i was a Republican, crossing party lines to vote for the candidate least likely to beat the GOP. :) that kind of thing happens in Texas all the time, not just this year.
anyway, back then — straight outta high school — i loved the GOP for two reasons (1) they walked all over those painsy-Dems. I mean seriously the party of Mondale? Dukakis? Gore? Kerry? i had never met a Dem like Clinton till after i graduated from college, and Clinton (either one, but especially Bubba) could have chewed up all of those four candidates as a snack. (2) GOP rhetoric sounded so good. i bought every GOP slogan hook line and hundred-ton-sinker. and i volunteered for the GOP and had posters filling my windows for passers-by to see (my parents hated that, but they still voted GOP. like most Pakistani expats, they also bought (exaggerated) GOP promises).
lesson: it’s easy to like the tough guy, and easier to swallow lies than to explore the realities behind them.
then i did an internship for a Democrat from Houston in his District Office and then in DC. somehow i could not get one in my local GOP candidate’s office, but all i had to do was walk in the door to get one with the Dem. i had been talked into this by a great brother here in Houston (he and his wife are even more active now, mashaAllah, and they did a joint presentation at TDC 2007. that’s all the hint. you’ll have to look up the speakers and then deduce from there).
the Dem was a great person in many respects — highly principled, not at all interested in the political side of being a Congressman — his license plate said “i’d rather be golfing.” he always voted for the interests of the poor in his District, even when that meant voting against huge pork-spending for Houston because he felt those billions-upon-billions should be spent on the poor (if on anything at all). subhanAllah, he also had many faults that we could easily pass off as belonging to non-Muslims. ’nuff said.
in this Dem’s office, i was assigned to do research on two super-liberal projects: death penalty sentencing reform and single payer health care. and i got to attend behind-closed-door meetings where GOP members of the Judiciary Committee refused to accept capitulations by Dems on Habeas Corpus stating, “we’re going to be able to get Habeas on our own, so we don’t have to give you anything for that.” i will never forget how ashamed those meetings made me. but i was a still a Republican in my mind.
the Dem was such a great guy that he wrote recommendation letters for me to the WHOLE Texas delegation (Dems and GOP alike). and i got an informational interview with the then-chief of staff of then-Congressman Tom Delay. :) yeah, i applied for a job with the exterminator himself. and it was a pivotal meeting, because i really liked the COS and his boss. and i was honest in my interview about what i had done as an intern, and how i felt about it.
and that GOP COS was so honest with me, yet he said in the nicest way possible, like i was made of glass, “maybe you should think about the issues you’ve been working on. because you sound to me like you might not be so happy in a Republican office.”
and that was how Allah let me realize how much my love for justice — at least on the issues i had researched and studied so far — would never let me defend conscientiously the actual positions (as opposed to the rhetoric) of the GOP.
but i was at best a third-rate Muslim.
and reason alone does not a firm footing make.
so i became as staunch a liberal as i had been a conservative.
and i reasoned that if the civil liberties of Muslims were under attack, then i could become friends with any group whose civil liberties were also under attack. ’nuff said.
and i worked on the full-time staff of two other Dems while i was in DC, and at least i can say that i never had to support for them any policy with which i was fundamentally opposed at the time.
but knowing and practicing my faith would have been better for me.
looking back, what was it i liked about the Dems i worked for? (1) they fought the good fight, and fought it with strength and conviction. (2) i believed their slogans, too, and believed that i was fighting for justice. sure — i had access to more information, so i could look behind and be privy to what was behind the slogans…
but maybe i just saw what i wanted to see. wAllaho’Alim. doesn’t Allah describe those who are misguided in similar terms? and when the misguided see a flash of lightning, then move until they are plunged back into darkness?
i think here is the one-liner/10-second-spot to take away from my post:
misguided people see what they want to see, so as much as you can, let Islam light your way.
Amad
October 11, 2008 at 9:49 AM
salam Asim. Welcome to MM bro.
I doubt you will find many who have attended, and many who planned to do so will probably be afraid after watching the videos.
So, why don’t you tell us… it will be most interesting. Also, I wonder if the sentiments are different if the muslim sister in hijab is a caucasian vs. “colored”??
Look forward to your comment.
Amad
October 11, 2008 at 9:52 AM
Br. AbuAbdullah, your comment was so informational and “real”, that it shed much more light on the situation than what many people could say or write.
mulsimah
October 11, 2008 at 11:46 AM
Its soo sad all the hate going on. why so much hate, im starting to get upset and angry over this. I mean the obama campaign cannot mention nething about muslims, for muslims or islam bc it will hurt their chances for winning. there was a meeting with his muslim outreach adviser with othr muslimssuch as nihad awad and mahdi bray who are so well respected but they are known as ‘controversial’ wow . gosh im surprised and hurt so just bc of that, they cannot even announnce it. the news was saying that the hate gets worse when sarah palin is campaigning with mcain. It is bc of their campaign in the first place that the hate stirred up. but Im really happy that he finally said something. it was def getting out of hand.
just look at obamas character, mashAllah he could resort to sooo many attackson them but he doesnt. sometims i wish he says something bak. like sarah palin ws convicted of abusing her power he should say something bout it, especially when she goes around saying he is ‘palling around with terrorists’ (the sad thing its working on some people) Obama could go on about mcains association with keating and the fact that mcains wife still did dealing w him after the scandal. obama could go on about mcains first wife and othr stuff about his character. his well known anger ect. why doesnt he!/ I mean dont people see it. im so tired of muslims saying they are equal in evil. i mean they just have not folowed the election enough, have known the policies have read their books to say that. i mean just bc of one statement obama says on pakistan. it just upsets me and infuriates me.
im really upset that in ny they put osama instead of obama in the ballot. how can you mistake that?!!!!!!!!! just look at your keyboard. and these are professional people. its hard to beleive they dont do a spell check and proofread their work. its absolutely wrong! i mean neone is going to have second thoughts when they see osama on the ballot. And also the obsession dvds are gonna hurt the election. i know in the polls hes ahead but the polls usually arent accurate. so yes im gonna be very upset and devastated if he doesnt win. people dont understand the seriousneess of the election.
david
October 11, 2008 at 3:47 PM
I am a mid 30 year old white professional and borders along the Atheist/Agnostic border I do have a deep understanding of the Islamic, Christianity, and Jewish religions for me a deeper understanding of other religions, cultures helps me understand differences between people and allows me to make more educated and well thought out decisions rather than erratic, emotional choices usually exploding with hatred and racism as so many in this country.
These videos just show how scary middle America who are most likely christian followers are with their hatred rhetoric.
I and nearly all of my friends, co-workers and family are voting for Obama….. McCain/Palin are beyond scary possibly just as bad or worse than what Bush did to this country and the world at large. I proudly have an Obama sticker on my Scion.
Whats interesting to me is, McCain supporters often spout cruel and often hatred towards Obama and anyone who doesn’t think the way they are, but when asked specific questions they are not able to give answers with details about Obama, what’s worse they can’t give educated reasons why they support McCain, can only repeat the zingers and headlines they read or listen to from the conservative sites. And having a debate with a McCain supporter is frustrating an educated deep thought discussion seems impossible.
Can’t wait till this election is over, hopefully Obama will win the election. Unfortunately he’ll inherit a country that GW Bush has completely destroyed financially, socially, and the world views towards Americans is deeply mangled.
mulsimah
October 11, 2008 at 4:01 PM
Hi David! Thats exactly right. Whenever asked the mcain campaign is never able to give any answers in detail. Im sure they have tried to look for anything they can find but it obvious they couldnt find anything! I hope we all can start living in peace regardless of religion. that security is obviously not given by mcain.
mulsimah
October 11, 2008 at 4:56 PM
so they found that palin abused the power as gov. scary what would she do as vice pres. themcain campaign is saying its a political game. ha! on nightlien on abc they said it was actually 10 republicans and only 3 or 4 democrats that made the decison. i hope they will repeat that in the news
Asim
October 11, 2008 at 6:55 PM
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/11/mccain.lewis/index.html
Here’s part of it:
Rep. John Lewis, D-Georgia, who has been praised by McCain in the past, issued his statement after several days of headline-grabbing anger aimed at Democratic nominee Barack Obama from some attendees at campaign rallies of McCain and running mate Gov. Sarah Palin.
“What I am seeing reminds me too much of another destructive period in American history. Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin are sowing the seeds of hatred and division, and there is no need for this hostility in our political discourse,” Lewis said in a statement.
“George Wallace never threw a bomb. He never fired a gun, but he created the climate and the conditions that encouraged vicious attacks against innocent Americans who were simply trying to exercise their constitutional rights. Because of this atmosphere of hate, four little girls were killed on Sunday morning when a church was bombed in Birmingham, Alabama,” wrote the Democrat.
A Nightingale
October 11, 2008 at 7:24 PM
Disgusting.
May Allah change their hearts and bring them towards the truth, ameen.
sincethestorm
October 11, 2008 at 7:52 PM
Just wondering if those people standing up in the audience spouting hateful things about Obama are apart of the McCain campaign. I wonder if the whole thing is staged. Those are things McCain can’t really say…but some stranger can get away with saying. Can’t put anything past the Republican party.
sincethestorm
October 11, 2008 at 7:55 PM
I saw the typographical error on the ballots….yeah it was an innocent oversight to type Osama instead of Obama. The letter ‘b’ is so far away from the letter ‘s’ on the keyboard. So Ogama, Ovama, Ohama ,Onama…are at least acceptable.
Asim
October 11, 2008 at 11:13 PM
Salam,
Br. Amad, good to hear from you too. Hope things are well with you and your family, insha’Allah.
Looks like no one who has attended a Republican Candidate’s Rally or meetings is going to speak up. Well then, it is my turn:
My wife and I attended a Republican Candidate’s Rally b4 the nomination. People, such as caucasian & “colored” (which btw, I am not happy of your way to pointing out – as I am considered one of them) were surprised to see us and were even nice enough to give us space in the front to see the candidate. Even Border Watch people were so happy to see two “legal” Muslims there that the members were introducing me to other members! Both of left the Rally happy and amazed at the response from everyone there.
The next step for both of us was to become a local delegates, which we were able to make. Then at the local convention, a leader had to be selected from the group of 20 or so caucasian & “colored” delegates, who would decide the final 4 delegates to go forward to the State convention. Everyone elected me to be the convention leader to decide who the 4 state delegates will be (mind you, everyone also voted that I would be one of the 4. Due to my job, I had to excuse myself. Amazing how no one called me a terrorist). After some discussion, I put forth my decision of who should go, and it was fully accepted by all. Again, why let a terrorist decide who gets to go? Maybe I did not present myself a nervous/secretive religious fanatic (even with my beard) to these caucasian & “colored” people. One person even asked me if in 4-yrs I would like to be the leader again? I politely said, we will see.
For me the videos you presented are one sided and biased. Stepping back here is what I see (mind you all, I am not condoning the behavior of ignorant people):
-Radical/neo conservative have put out a propaganda that fits their agenda. True conservatives are listening to them and without a true Muslim spokesperson to consult, they believe what they hear.
-I saw Dem. supporters present at the Rep. convention. Nothing wrong with that. But what I did not hear was what they may have been saying to the Rep. supporters? Does anyone have a full transcript of what was said all day long there from both sides?
-I c the title as miss leading tool to get Muslim’s angered and vote for Obama. What does anyone know about Obama? What has he done for Muslims? Has he shown any support to Muslims? Damned if he does and Damned if he dont.
-lastly, we only saw a few of the thousands present making some ignorant comments. Does that justify the whole party attitude? Be careful how you think this out in your head. A few radicals in Islam does not mean Islam is “BAD”. The few radicals are the “Bad’ ones!
I for one will not vote rep. or dem. b/c as a Muslim, my vote for either is a sign of my support for them which I will have to answer for on the day of judgement. Will Allah give me a break for saying: “I chose the lesser of the Evils”?
Step back…….think about it…….now decide what is best for you and your emaan.
Asim
Sirat
October 11, 2008 at 11:17 PM
I wonder if the Prophet (SAWS) was alive and living as a minority in this land, would he participate so passionately in voting for one of 2 candidates, when both have agreed to fight muslims and give muslim blood and land to the jews; except one is more extreme than the other.
Its almost like they have given you 2 plates with different kinds of distasteful food, and you are asked to pick the one you find relatively more appealing. Can’t we just stay away from this mess and absolve ourselves of the liability of bringing into power one who is not a believer in Allah, and one who will, of a surety, implement laws that go against our deen (ie gay rights, killing babies, fighting muslims, etc)?
Note that voting is a privelege, not an obligation; as muslims we have the option to stay clear.
Just a reminder, so that on the day of judgement there is no excuse.
Amad
October 11, 2008 at 11:21 PM
salam Asim… good to hear your account… but i am a bit confused… you won’t vote either one due to religious reasons, but you were part of the whole process, including being a delegate? What am I missing here?
By the way, by not voting for the lesser of the evil, one may help the “more evil” party achieve victory, so in some ways not voting may contribute to making things worse right (at least from what is apparent, only Allah knows what will happen). I don’t doubt that there are legitimate arguments and differences of opinion on voting, but I don’t believe, with all due respect, that those differences are based on the premise you promised.
Sirat, I understand your sentiments, but this post is really not meant to discuss the issue of voting. We cannot allow ourselves to become one-track Muslims, and only consider one issue. Those who live here in America have to live with ALL of the President’s policies, not just foreign policy. So, we have to do what we feel is best for us AND our future generations, as well as paying attention to which candidate offers a better chance of a better foreign policy. As we know inshallah, there are enough scholars and people of knowledge who have allowed voting, or even encouraged participation. And as I stated earlier, I know there are respectable scholars on the other side of this issue too. So, we would like to move on: Those who prefer not to vote, don’t have to. While giving those who would like to vote the opportunity to make a more educated decision on who to vote for.
Asim
October 12, 2008 at 12:13 AM
Salam,
LOL. Br Amad, as always I find amuzement in ur comments. :)
I guess u read my post but did not understand it. Look into the meaning of the words.
Here is the point: As Muslims, look at every angle before you make a decision. Many a times, it is only a one sided view u r being shown.
I did my part till my candidate (who had the best interest for all) did not make it. Your comment about “by not voting for the lesser of the evil, one may help the “more evil” party achieve victory” does not fit me. I did my part from the start. Where were the Muslim’s then? Ah yes, waiting to see who would be the best candidate to pick from so that they can feel winners!! (For some that was not the case). And who said there were only two parties to pick from….oh yes, we do not care for the loosers anyway…..hahahaha.
Sometimes u win, sometimes u loose. In this case, I lost in pushing through who I thought had the best interest for us (and Allah knows best) and I am a better person for it. May Allah keep us all protected from those who wish harm upon us. Ameen.
Till next article, insha’Allah. Take care.
Asim
h. ahmed
October 12, 2008 at 2:52 AM
This “lesser of two evils” concept is being abused here.
Yes – Barack Obama is FAAAR from perfect. You will not find perfection in any candidate – or any human for that matter. Yes – i can find many flaws in his stance on the ISraeli-Palestinian conflict, on the US Health Care system (but his stance FAAAAR supercedes that of McCain’s), the war in Afghanistan, and others. But his views on virtually EVERY issue is far better than that of McCain’s and he has some great ideas on restoring America’s image, increased diplomacy, ending the war in Iraq, etc.
If you want to “just stay away from this mess and absolve ourselves of the liability of bringing into power one who is not a believer in Allah, and one who will, of a surety, implement laws that go against our deen (ie gay rights, killing babies, fighting muslims, etc)?” – then u shouldnt even be living in such a country where u pay taxes that support all that you mentioned in that sentence. Because whether you like it or not – by living here u are to some degree supporting the power that be – and it should be your obligation to do – to the best of your ability – vote in those that best reflect your views and stances.
For those of you who were Ron Paul fans – he wouldve been the worst person to have run for president during this economic crisis for he was completely anti-regulation – and what we need now is to control and oversight all those greedy people in wall street, running the banks, etc.
And if all that isnt enough, for those of you at ISNA, Imam Zaid Shakir and Shaykh Hamza Yusuf – two of our greatest American Muslim leaders have all but explicitly (because of ISNA being a 501c organization) stated their support for Obama over McCain. Imam Suhaib Webb also proudly stats on his website that he is voting for Obama. Many of the contributors here at Muslim Matters have also proclaimed their support for Obama.
Hassan
October 12, 2008 at 7:18 AM
If they had listened to Ron Paul for last 20 years, America would have not be in mess that it is in right now. Obama would put band aid to the problem, and it would come back in 10-20 years again.
Republican party is having serious issues, its ideal time to get involved in it like brother Asim did. We should align with true conservatives, and bring it back to its root. Would it be perfect for muslims? No, but we would have Independence to do social welfare ourselves rather than government dictating it.
BTW Obama’s economic policies suck.
Amad
October 12, 2008 at 10:20 AM
Hassan, if you evaluate opinions of Muslims in America (like the Pew poll I believe done a year ago?), most of our views are not aligned with strict conservatives. Muslims, in general and in majority, want the government involved in social services, such as health, poverty-eradication, education, etc. And that is not the Republican, esp. Ron Paul’s, agenda. Muslims are compassionate “liberals”, regardless of labels. Yes, there are areas of overlaps with conservatives, but for the most part they cover personal values, which affect individuals.
Yes, no doubt, neither party comes close to representing us fully, but Democratic ideals, imho, are closer and the party is also, in general, more welcoming.
Finally, now that it is clear that br.Asim’s experience was with the Ron Paul group (did I get that right?), I think that experience would be different from general republicans? I find Abuabdullah’s take on his inside experience with republicans more telling.
I have not heard any argument, asking us to vote McCain, but rather to not vote again, which in effect supports McCain. That is not my opinion, that is the fact.
I urge my Muslim brothers and sisters to get past the rancor, and get out and vote. Become relevant! Let the media capture for America to see jilbabs, hijabs, niqabs, beards, a few thowbs, topis, and whatever suits you, in the voting lines :) And while you are out there, help defeat Bush part-2, and vote for Obama :) (my personal opinion does not represent MM).
Wallahualam
Amad
October 12, 2008 at 11:07 AM
Great article, again making my point much more effectively than I did:
The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama
Hassan
October 12, 2008 at 11:09 AM
Amad bhai, being a muslim, alhamdulillah I am not anti-social or anti-helping poor etc. If I were in a Muslim state I would like government that would do that. And I think when muslims are polled, they give their ideals, but if they know the reality, and still align with democrat, than I am surprised. I mean how hard is to understand that, with democrats (and current republicans alike), you would get many things you like but you would get many things you would not. That is why I like Ron Paul take of conservatism (real conservatism), in which government is least involved. So I can do my religious obligations and we can do community work through our islamic organizations. Moreover, I mean how cool it would be that I send my kids to Islamic school on voucher rather than paying so much.
While liberals and democrats may do good in some aspect but they shove many things down your throat that you do not like. For example, in one of Hillary Clinton’s book, she says that we need to teach people good morals etc at public places, like DMVs (DPS), on LCDs there, while they wait for their turn. I can only imagine what kind of morality she would be teaching there…
True conservatism is our survival here, when we are left alone. Imagine a day when you can have upto 4 wives, and government knows it, and does not do anything… :D
AbuAbdAllah, the Houstonian
October 13, 2008 at 2:33 AM
innalhamdolillah. bismillah.
well, it certainly appears that the comments have tracked towards the vote-don’t-vote divide.
for a moment, please, way back on the topic of the thread, i agree with Asim and other voices that the videos themselves do not indict all Republicans. but i would have loved to have seen the video of Republicans speaking intelligently and calmly about Obama, Democrats, and Muslims. trouble with that video? technical difficulties, maybe? too many hoods and burning crosses causing the image to go white? :P
AbuAbdAllah, the Houstonian
October 13, 2008 at 2:38 AM
bismillah. okay, that vote-no-vote divide may be a bottomless pit, but i will walk with you along its edge, too. :)
for my part, i also fear the questions that Allah subhanahu wata ala may ask me:
what did i do for my neighbors in their hour of need? when i saw them divided over two completely different approaches to governance, and they asked for shura, did i take part?
what did i do for the Muslims in Muslim lands? especially since it is clear that i have not gone to them to stand beside them and share their burdens. when there was any hope to send a message to the eminent of this country — to which i pay taxes and swear/profess fealty — how exactly did i make it clear that i care for the future of policies that hurt or benefit Muslims in Muslims lands? did i send instead the message that those in power could do what they like?
and that last paragraph was really tough to swallow — because it implies a fact that is often ignored by those who stand around this divide: whether you cast a vote or not will NOT be sufficient for you on the Day of Judgment.
so forgive me, please, if i step back now from this ever-yawning chasm of rhetoric: we all have a duty to follow in the sunnah of the Prophet sull Allaho alayhi wa sallam, the same sunnah of Musa alayhis salam — to speak truth to power firmly but respectfully, in a way that befits the powerful, that encourages the best response, and the best response is always towards that which would please Allah.
i believe voting speaks truth to power in a way that makes the powerful truly motivated to listen to you (for their own ends, surely, but listening!).
so, inshaAllah, i will vote. and before i vote, i will make istikhara.
and after i vote, the burden will NOT be lifted from me to continue to engage the eminent and seek what is good.
wAllaho’Alim.
mulsimah
October 13, 2008 at 12:25 PM
how can you say it will not be sufficient to us in the day of judgement if we do not vote??????? ofcourse it will. not voting is supporting mcain and helpin. most scholars say that particiapting in politics in nonmuslim countries is our ‘duty’ and some say obligation! mcain has not timeline to end this war and we know obama does. how long more do we want people to die, to get killed?????do u know what o war is doing o the people of iraq. if u dont vote u obvisouldy dont know the horrors of war. just think about it. when we know one is going to head to end this war we have an obligation to vote for that person! what about those suffereing torture. what if it was you?! obama has personally helped the guantanamo lawyers! he has been taking alot of action and the guantanamo lawyers all support him bc of this. mcain on the other hand voted for the patriot act! and voted against habeas corpus for the detainees. how can any muslim not vote for obama and how can any muslim not vote or vote for mcain. br Amad is right.
h. ahmed
October 14, 2008 at 12:47 AM
everyone, please listen to this: http://www.hahmed.com/blog/2008/10/14/keith-ellison-speech-civic-participation-for-muslims-mp3/
(amad, u may want to make this front page material, the original source is from suhaibwebb.com)
Asim
October 14, 2008 at 6:21 AM
Salams all,
I definitely think this is worth a new post: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LXMMmfd1lw
FINALLY! Someone in the mainstream media gets it RIGHT about Muslims. Thanks Campbell.
AbuZakariyya
October 14, 2008 at 10:26 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/13/campbell.brown.obama/index.html#cnnSTCVideo
AbuAbdAllah, the Houstonian
October 15, 2008 at 1:35 AM
innalhamdolillah. bismillah.
my sister mulsimah, i think you have misunderstood what i wrote. my apologies for that to you and to anyone else, especially if the fault lies in my grammar or diction.
i wrote (in bold print no less) “whether you cast a vote or not will NOT be sufficient for you on the Day of Judgment.”
first, i should have written as i do now: wAllaho’Alim. because Allah alone is Master of the Day of Judgment. He will reward even an atom’s weight of deeds — and He will reward the good that we do, all of it — and He may punish the evil we do if He does not forgive it. Rabbana laa tu’akhidnaa innaseenaa aw akhta’naa. ameen.
second, many Muslims this year will debate endlessly over whether to vote. not for whom to vote — whether to vote. and most of the people have already made up their minds.
i believe it is essential for Muslims to vote in the West (and thus to register to vote, etc).
voting is something too many Muslims disparage without thinking how much their reticence plays into the hands of the Sarkozy‘s, Bush’s, and Zardari’s of the world. that Sarkozy link is from a far-left and ultra-honest UK article that five years ago defended the rights of Muslim women in France (and around Europe) and denounced the attacks by then-cabinet member Sarkozy. and can anyone not shake their heads at the voting debacles that propelled Bush and Zardari to office?
despite all that, we will never convince every Muslim who can vote to do so. those Muslims are entitled to their beliefs, too. but i do ask those who do not vote: has Muslim political disenfranchisement in France helped any of the Muslim women in France?
since Allah alone guides — i want to remind all of us — voters and non-voters alike — that there are so many more things we should be doing!
small things like using “Digg” to bring mainstream visibility to thoughtful articles here on MM and elsewhere.
more substantial but also easy things like signing the petition for humane treatment of Dr. Aafia. and responding to letter-writing requests by groups actively protesting injustices against Muslims.
more difficult things like showing up in court to hold the government accountable
or definitive tests like standing up to the face of hate.
i hope i was more clear.
AsimG
October 15, 2008 at 8:21 PM
I’m a Muslim, I’m from Illinois and I support Obama.
Crap, guess I’m on the terror watch list now :(
ibn Fellah
October 17, 2008 at 11:20 AM
Let’s kick wala wa bara in its backside…who needs it?
muslim
October 18, 2008 at 11:29 AM
salam bros/sis,
make dua for khilafa and work for it instead of wasting time on obama/mccain. They are not going to bring peace in muslim lands. They will do the same as others did in the past. People occupying our lands should be kicked out not begged to be out. Dont expect these kuffar will do any good to muslims. FEAR ALLAH and correct your basics…oh wait correct the basics of your scholars first….
mulsimah
October 18, 2008 at 2:09 PM
ok those of you who were defending the mcain campaign think again. they are doing vile things . they are msileading and using robo calls to tell people that obama is connected to bill ayers and wants to kill babies.. and stuff. and they are sending mails also. many people are getting calls, i think one turned out to be racist
check http://www.huffingtonpost.com and http://www.michaelmoore.com for more info.
thien
October 24, 2008 at 11:34 AM
Hi, I’m french and i’m very interested in this debate.
Something raises my curiosity. I saw in a recent video, Muslim at a pro-McCain rally and I just wonder why some Muslim vote for McCain. Could you explain me please their motivations and why they would vote for an political view who diabolize so much your religion! Thanks in anticipation for your answer :)
Rifai
October 24, 2008 at 1:22 PM
Hello Thien, I believe there are some different reasons for this. Maybe the Muslims who do support Mccain are just rich and like the economic poilicies of the party that re likely to ehance their position.
Also , they might just be naive and unwilling to accept that the Republican party is running on an agenda promoting fear and intolerance of a minority. Though this will likely not be touted by the party as an official stance, as much comes across from the polemics of staunch republicans and conservatives in the media. We do note that the Mccain campaign does not aggressively seek to dispel such notions that have formed about their party and this appears to be an intelligent effort to avoid alienating their bigotted base of supporters.
In addition , they might be aligned with the idea of aggressive foriegn policy based on the moral excellence of America(which does not really exist -just a ploy to dupe the gullible masses). This again ties in to such Muslims just being being plainly naive.
For all the faults of the Republican party , there are some issues held in common with Muslim interest. For example, opposition to abortion, gay marriage, etc. These are more understandable reasons a Muslims might identify with the pary.
Others can probably give more reasons, but these are the ones which come to mind.
thien
October 24, 2008 at 5:38 PM
thanks a lot Rifai, it seems quite clear for me know. One of my friends suggest that we may suppose that Obama was a Muslim and is not anymore, that’s why some Muslim can do not like him. Is it thinkable?