mawlid2

In reading the various seasonal polemics these days on the Mawlid, I have come across those who, of all people, quote Shaykhul Islam Ibn Taimiyyah as a supporter of the Mawlid. They even provide two quotes three pages apart from one of his books, separated conveniently by an ellipses […]. I thought to explore this topic further in a reply which turned into such a beautiful reading that I thought I would share it with you so that maybe more justice could be done to his wise and beautiful words insha'Allah.

Before exploring his words, let us begin with a few important points. The title of the book that was quoted itself says a lot about Ibn Taimiyyah's position – Iqtidaa' al-Sirat al-Mustaqeem li Mukhaalafat ashaab al-Jaheem (Following the Straight Path in Differentiating from the Companions of the Hell-Fire). Thus, his book was primarily focused on encouraging Muslims to avoid imitating the ways of the disbelievers. In fact, the very chapter from which the quotes are taken is entitled, “The Chapter on Innovated Festivals of a Seasonal Nature”. In the early part of this chapter he provides us with a very important principle:

إذ الأعياد شريعة من الشرائع ، فيجب فيها الاتباع ، لا الابتداع

“Festivals are acts of a religious nature derived from the Shari'ah, and as such we must have a precedent to follow and not to innovate.”

Moving on to the section that is often only partially quoted, let us now translate it more fully and take some time to discover what else was mentioned in the three pages skipped over by the ellipses […]:

وكذلك ما يحدثه بعض الناس ، إما مضاهاة للنصارى في ميلاد عيسى عليه السلام ، وإما محبة للنبي صلى الله عليه وسلم ، وتعظيمًا . والله قد يثيبهم على هذه المحبة والاجتهاد ، لا على البدع- من اتخاذ مولد النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم عيدًا . مع اختلاف الناس في مولده . فإن هذا لم يفعله السلف ، مع قيام المقتضي له وعدم المانع منه لو كان خيرًا . ولو كان هذا خيرًا محضا ، أو راجحًا لكان السلف رضي الله عنهم أحق به منا ، فإنهم كانوا أشد محبة لرسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم وتعظيمًا له منا ، وهم على الخير أحرص .

“And so is the case with what some people have innovated, either in imitation of the Christians who celebrate the birthday of Jesus (as) or out of love for the Prophet (saas) and in order to exalt him. And it may be that Allah may reward them for this love and for the ijtihaad they made, but not for the innovation of taking the birthday of the Prophet (saas) as a festival; despite the differences regarding his actual birthday. For indeed, this was an act never performed by the earlier generations … had it been good in essence or correct Islamically, then those earlier generations (may Allah be pleased with them) would have more right to such a deed than us, for they had greater love for the Messenger (saas) and exalted him more than we do, and they were more concerned and ardent with performing good deeds than us.”

وإنما كمال محبته وتعظيمه في متابعته وطاعته واتباع أمره ، وإحياء سنته باطنًا وظاهرًا ، ونشر ما بعث به ، والجهاد على ذلك بالقلب واليد واللسان . فإن هذه طريقة السابقين الأولين ، من المهاجرين والأنصار ، والذين اتبعوهم بإحسان . وأكثر هؤلاء الذين تجدهم حراصًا على أمثال هذه البدع ، مع ما لهم من حسن القصد ، والاجتهاد الذين يرجى لهم بهما المثوبة ، تجدهم فاترين في أمر الرسول

“And loving him and exalting him (saas) in truth is through following him, obeying him and adhering to his instructions; by reviving his Sunnah both outwardly and inwardly; by spreading the guidance with which he was sent; and by striving upon all of that with our hearts, hands and tongues. Indeed, this was the way of the foremost among the earlier generations from the Muhajireen and Ansaar and those who followed them with excellence. Whereas the majority of those whom you find enthusiastic to implement such innovations as what we have discussed – despite what they may have of good intentions and ijtihaad, and it is hoped that Allah will reward them for these two (intention and ijtihaad) – yet you generally find them weak and apathetic in regards to adhering to the instructions of the Messenger (saas) …”

وإنما هم بمنزلة من يحلي المصحف ولا يقرأ فيه ، أو يقرأ فيه ولا يتبعه وبمنزلة من يزخرف المسجد ، ولا يصلي فيه ، أو يصلي فيه قليلًا

“Instead, they are like the one who opens the Qur'an but doesn't read from it, or if he reads from it, he doesn't implement it; or like the one who decorates the masjid but doesn't pray in it, or prays in it rarely …”

تدعو الناس إلى السنة بحسب الإمكان فإذا رأيت من يعمل هذا ولا يتركه إلا إلى شر منه ، فلا تدعو إلى ترك منكر بفعل ما هو أنكر منه ولكن إذا كان في البدعة من الخير ، فعوض عنه من الخير المشروع بحسب الإمكان ، إذ النفوس لا تترك شيئًا إلا بشيء

He then continues by encouraging the reader with two manners in regards to dealing with such innovations, the second of them being:

“to call people to adhere to the Sunnah as best as possible. Hence, if you see someone upon such an innovation (Mawlid), and you suspect that if he leaves it then he will do something worse, then do not forbid an evil that results in a greater evil … but instead, if in any given innovation there is some good, then you should compensate for the evil within it with any legislated good that you can; for indeed the hearts don't typically abandon something unless it is for something else.”

In case you are trying to make sense of these concepts, an example from Ibn Taimiyyah's life itself may clarify it greatly insha'Allah. It has been narrated that once Ibn Taimiyyah was walking with his students when they came across some drunken Mongol soldiers. In his time, the Mongolians had invaded the Muslim lands, including Iraq where he was born, and they had decimated these lands with a degree of killing heretofore never seen. From the mercy of Allah though, these invaders came to accept Islam even though this didn't result in the absolute cessation of their hostilities and atrocities, but it did protect the Muslims to a greater degree alhamdulillah. In any case, Ibn Taimiyyah refrained from censuring these Muslim soldiers and his students asked him why he didn't forbid the soldiers from the evil (drinking alcohol) that they were openly doing. He answered them with great wisdom by saying that when they are sober they kill Muslims, and this is a far greater evil then their drinking (lesser of two evils).

So, in summary what may seem like Ibn Taimiyyah validating or permitting the celebration of the Mawlid is in theory no different than this example. While there are some observant Muslims who do participate in these celebrations, there is also a large group of people as he observed above, who take this as another excuse for another party. It is well known in many Muslim societies what happens at Mawlids from mixing of the sexes, tabarruj (women coming out displaying their beauty), people neglecting their prayers or partying so late that they sleep through fajr, etc. Again, this is not to say that this is only what happens, but it happens often enough unfortunately.

As regards those who are observant and keen to follow the Sunnah, such people should be presented with the evidences and encouraged to repent – and it should suffice most observant Muslims that celebrating the Mawlid was never a deed that was practiced among the early generations (nor was the concept of celebrating a birthday even to be found among them) and that there is no report in the Qur'an, hadith or statements of the Companions on this matter whatsoever. As for the less observant group, one has to use wisdom. Is it possible to try to influence these gatherings so as to reduce the mixing and tabarruj and to increase the focus on learning the life of the Prophet (saas) and his Sunnah? What good exists in any particular Mawlid celebration that we can try to build upon so as to diminish the impact of the evil that exists in it? This is the wisdom with which Ibn Taimiyyah approached this matter.

As for the remainder of the text, for completion it will be translated here as well insha'Allah so that one can continue to appreciate Ibn Taimiyyah's very fair minded approach to the whole issue and to remind those who would censure others to remember their own shortcomings:

وكثير من المنكرين لبدع العبادات والعادات تجدهم مقصرين في فعل السنن من ذلك ، أو الأمر به . ولعل حال كثير منهم يكون أسوأ من حال من يأتي بتلك العبادات المشتملة على نوع من الكراهة . بل الدين هو الأمر بالمعروف والنهي عن المنكر ، ولا قوام لأحدهما إلا بصاحبه ، فلا ينهى عن منكر إلا ويؤمر بمعروف يغني عنه كما يؤمر بعبادة الله سبحانه ، وينهى عن عبادة ما سواه

“And many of those who censure others in regards to innovations either in worship or traditions, you find them deficient in practicing some acts from the Sunnah in these two categories or in encouraging others to do them. And indeed it may even be that their condition is worse than some of those who are practicing these innovations that are tainted with some degree of dislike (makruh). For the religion is to command good and to forbid evil and neither of these two takes precedence over the other. So one should not forbid an evil without commanding a good to take its place in the same way that we call people to the worship of Allah alone after having forbid them from worshipping others beside Him.”

To briefly comment on this beautiful point, we are reminded of the statement of Ibn 'Abbaas wherein he said,

عن ابن عباس قال ما أتى على الناس عام إلا أحدثوا فيه بدعة وأماتوا فيه سنة حتى تحيا البدع وتموت السنن

“Never will a year come to pass except that its people will invent in it an innovation and kill thereby a Sunnah until the innovation is established and the Sunnah dies off.”

It is not enough to simply forbid someone from a deed, but we should help them to replace what they were upon of innovation or disobedience with something from the Qur'an and Sunnah thereby reviving the practice of the Prophet (saas) and killing off the evils. Also, we must remember that humility is a great part of righteousness and this entails the assumption that the one to whom we are speaking is better than us. Even though they may have erred and been swept up by a certain innovation or temptation from the evils of the world, it may be that they are more sincere than us and practice more of the Sunnah elsewhere than us. This is why Ibn Taimiyyah humbly hoped that Allah would reward them, for who knows what innovations we may unknowingly be practicing or even worse, if we have some hidden shirk within our hearts. This was among the reasons the Prophet (saas) used to encourage us with the following du'a which he taught to Abu Bakr (ra):

الشرك فيكم أخفى من دبيب النمل وسأدلك على شيء إذا فعلته أذهب عنك صغار الشرك وكباره تقول اللهم إني أعوذ بك أن أشرك بك وأنا أعلم وأستغفرك لما لا أعلم - تقولها ثلاث مرات

The Shirk among you is more hidden than the crawling of an ant, but I shall guide you to that which if you do it, will protect you from both minor shirk and the greater type as well; to say three times:

Allahumma innee a'uthu bika an ushrika bika wa ana a'lam wa-astaghfiruka limaa laa a'lam

“O Allah, I seek refuge in You from that I ascribe partners to You knowingly and I seek forgiveness from You for those things which I do not know.” (Sahih – Albaani, Sahih al-Jaami' as-Sagheer; similar narration in Bukhari's Adab al-Mufrad)

Back to the translation though:

فتعظيم المولد ، واتخاذه موسمًا ، قد يفعله بعض الناس ، ويكون له فيه أجر عظيم لحسن قصده ، وتعظيمه لرسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم ، كما قدمته لك أنه يحسن من بعض الناس ولهذا قيل للإمام أحمد عن بعض الأمراء : إنه أنفق على مصحف ألف دينار ، أو نحو ذلك فقال : دعهم ، فهذا أفضل ما أنفقوا فيه الذهب ، أو كما قال . مع أن مذهبه أن زخرفة المصاحف مكروهة . … إنما قصده أن هذا العمل فيه مصلحة ، وفيه أيضًا مفسدة كره لأجلها . فهؤلاء إن لم يفعلوا هذا ، وإلا اعتاضوا بفساد لا صلاح فيه ، مثل أن ينفقها في كتاب من كتب الفجور

“So to magnify the birthday of the Prophet (saas) and to take it as a seasonal celebration, as some people might do and it might be that they are rewarded greatly for their good intentions and for their exalting of the Messenger of Allah (saas), for as I have previously mentioned that some among them do so in a good way … and in this regards it has been reported that imam Ahmad once said about one of the Muslim rulers that had reportedly spent one thousand dinaars or so for a (decorated) copy of the Qur'an, “Leave him be, for that is the best thing which gold can be spent upon”. But it is well known that the math-hab of imam Ahmad looks upon the decoration of the Qur'an as something disliked (makruh). Yet what the imam meant by his statement was that this act had some goodness in it and also some defect that we dislike. For if they were prevented from doing this act it may be that they will then turn to another deed which has no goodness in it whatsoever but is instead evil in its entirety like buying immoral books and so forth …”

In conclusion, there is no doubt that the Mawlid celebrations of our era have evolved to some degree from the time of Ibn Taimiyyah, but his principles hold true and we must approach each group, and indeed each innovation we may come across, in a way that is filled with wisdom and the sincere desire to help our Muslim brothers and sisters – whom we are commanded to love, prefer and respect – to achieve that which is over-all better for them as regards their relationship with Allah while at the same time remembering that we may be speaking to those who despite their error may indeed be better than us and more beloved to Allah, and Allah knows best.

103 Responses

  1. abu tufayl

    but what makes you believe that ibn taymiyyah has the final say and authority in this matter?

    why not read the opinions of ibn hajar al-asqalani, al-haytami, al-suyuti and others on the mawlid?

    much of what ibn taymiyya and yourself say about the practices of mingling between the sexes, missing of prayers and etc, were and still are denounced by nearly all shaykhs today who also celebrate the mawlid.

    sorry, most sincere muslims who celebrate the mawlid, dont sit around a table, have a party with women and blow candles off a cake.

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  2. Abu Abdurrahman

    jazakumAllahu khairan Ya Ustadh Ali!

    AhsanAllahu ilaykum!

    The practioners of a bid’ah – it is of course hoped – will, from a point of law (takleef) be meriting reward for their love and reverence and even perhaps the adhkar they may say (as long as it does not contain any unpermitted elements) – the problem only comes in the action as a composite.

    The justice in this reminds me of another passage of Ibn Tyaymiyyah rahimahullah, where he explains that it is from this samejustice that the hand of the thief is cut, but he [may] also be given the financial help from the State.

    JazakumAllahu khairan once again.

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  3. Mas'ud Ahmed Khan

    as-salamu ‘alaykum,

    Ibn Taymiyya (R) is not an authority on this matter, what of Ibn Kathir (R) who was once a student of Ibn Taymiyya and his acceptance of the Mawlid? There are more ulama past and present and more prominent and more widely accepted ulama than Ibn Taymiyya that have accepted the principle and practice of the Mawlid. The issue is a no-brainer really.

    With regards to “just another excuse for a party” and “free mixing of the sexes” you can observe the same behaviour during the two eids. Young Muslim guys, blinged up for the occasion and heading to large city centre to have “fun” and cruise. Young Muslim girls all dressed to the nines and dressed to kill go out to celebrate. Let’s not throw the baby out with the bathwater here, all the Mawlids that I have ever been to throughout my 41 year old life have been celebrations full of Qur’an, Sunnah, Seerha, dhikr, qasa’id, adab and light upon light. Proper segregation of men and women was observed and no lewd or unbecoming behaviour was observed. Isn’t this the case of, if you go looking for faults you will find them? If you go looking for such behaviour during the Hajj season in the Haram, you will find it. Rather like the Saudi religious police who assume that people are always up to no good, where is the Sunnah of Husn al-Dhann?

    wa’as-salam

    Mas’ud

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  4. abu Rumay-s.a.

    Dear Brother Masud:

    Let me for the sake of argument agree with you that Ibn Taimiyyah (ra) is not an authority and the scholars that you believe are more prominent have accepted the principle and practice of Mawlid. So in essence you are arguing those scholars who are more “prominent” should be referred to and followed.

    (According to your argument) I hope you would agree with me that Abu Bakr (ra), Umar (ra), Uthman (ra), and Ali (ra) are more prominent and widely accepted than those scholars you hold as authorities validating Mawlid ?

    If your answer is Yes, then shouldn’t we follow their judgment/way regarding this issue because their love to the Prophet (saws) is attested by Allah and His Messenger (saws) and their knowledge surpasses that of those who followed them?

    May Allah guide us to what pleases Him and increase us in our love for our Messenger (saws)..

    your brother

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  5. Ibn Rahma

    Jazak Allah khairun Sidi Mas’ud!

    May Allah join those who love Rasulillah SAWS with close proximity to him in this life and the next..in accordance with the Prophetic promise “a man is with whom he loves”.

    Ameen!

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  6. Ibn Mikdad

    “Ibn Taymiyya (R) is not an authority on this matter”

    What in the world does this mean? Since when can harmony of one’s opinion with your own be used to decide whether someone is a competent scholar or not? It’s like saying “you are not an authority because you disagree with me”. Simply saying “I believe he was wrong”, even though still mistaken, would be a much more sensible thing to say.

    “There are more ulama past and present and more prominent and more widely accepted ulama than Ibn Taymiyya that have accepted the principle and practice of the Mawlid.”

    There were times when “scholars” of different innovated sects have been much more numerous and much more widely accepted than the scholars of Ahlusunnah; would that make the obligation of following them (Ahlusunnah) at those times a no-brainer issue?

    “Rather like the Saudi religious police who assume that people are always up to no good, where is the Sunnah of Husn al-Dhann?”

    Yap, whenever out of meaningful things to say against the sunnah, run for the “Saudis are savages” cover.

    I will never stop to wonder how can people who don’t even fulfill some of the easiest and most basic sunnan of the Prophet s.a.w.s. (Allah s.w.t. says clearly in the Qur’an that the following of the Prophet s.a.w.s. is sign of love of Allah s.w.t.) claim to love him more than others, and express their love in a way not prescribed by him, s.a.w.s., and thus do that which was most despised by him, innovate things into religion. That is a real no-brainer.

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  7. Abû Mûsâ Al-Ḥabashî
    “Rather like the Saudi religious police who assume that people are always up to no good, where is the Sunnah of Husn al-Dhann?”

    Yap, whenever out of meaningful things to say against the sunnah, run for the “Saudis are savages” cover.

    lol So true.

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  8. Abd- Allah

    What I have come to realize is that there is no point in discussing this issue anymore.

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  9. Ghareebah

    -salaams-

    Are we, as Muslims, not meant to be totally different from the kuffaars…? Does that not also include them celebrating Christmas, and us not..?
    And the Mawlid is just the same as Christmas, just with another name… And besides if it was to be celebrated…wouldn’t our Prophet -saas- celebrate his own birthday…? then turn in to a sunnah of celebrating his birthday AND our birthdays….?

    It all makes sense.. when we’re told not to celebrate birthdays..including the Prophet’s -saas- birthday… right…?

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  10. Majid Hussain

    Assalaamu Alaykum

    If Abu Lahab, the disbelieving uncle of our Prophet (Upon him be blessings and peace), can receive relief from his punishment in hellfire on Mondays because he freed his slavegirl in joy after hearing of the birth of his nephew then what will be the outcome of believers who commerate such an occasion?

    Also, the Prophet (Upon him be blessings and peace) commemorated his own birth by fasting.

    Wa Alaykum Assalaam

    Majid

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  11. Ali Shehata

    Salaam alaikum

    My apologies in regards to the timing of this post – it was written about two weeks ago but had to be delayed and so it may seem a little belated at the present time.

    Brother Majid,

    The statement you are referring to has no basis in the sunnah of the Prophet (saas). I had intended to do a comprehensive write-up of this “hadith” that some people use as a basis but decided that the issue would be better brought up another time if there is interest in understanding it. To sum it up though, there are people who state that there is a statement in Sahih al-Bukhari to the effect of Abu Lahab having his punishment in the Hellfire lessened every Monday due to him setting Thuwayba free on the occasion of the birth of the Prophet (saas). In reality, the only mention of this matter in Bukhari is that Abu Lahab set a slave free (time not specified) and that she became one of the nursemaids of the Prophet (saas). The added details of this being due to the birth of the Prophet are not authenticated either by hadith or by history (Seerah). The matter of him having his punishment lessened comes from a dream that someone had, but again this dream report is not authenticated in any valid hadith or any valid report for that matter, and beyond that, dreams have never been a source of legislation for Ahl as-Sunnah wal-Jamaa’ah.

    As regards his commemoration of his own birthday by fasting, I believe this has been dealt with extensively in comments to Sh. Yasir’s posts on the matter so I will not say anything other than to remind you that Eids in Islam are days when fasting is prohibited. Insha’Allah you can refer to Sh. Yasir’s posts and the comments to them for further information, was-salaam alaikum

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  12. Ibn Mikdad

    “If Abu Lahab, the disbelieving uncle of our Prophet (Upon him be blessings and peace), can receive relief from his punishment in hellfire on Mondays because he freed his slavegirl in joy after hearing of the birth of his nephew then what will be the outcome of believers who commerate such an occasion?

    Also, the Prophet (Upon him be blessings and peace) commemorated his own birth by fasting. ”

    1. Freeing a slave is not an innovation; it was confirmed as a good deed by our Prophet, s.a.w.s., and was encouraged as such. Unlike the manumission of the slaves, celebration of birthdays, including that of the Prophet, s.a.w.s., is an innovation never spoken of, recommended, encouraged, or anything to that effect by him, s.a.w.s. Your pathetic attempt to try to portrait those who acknowledge mawlid for the bid’ah that it is as loones who can appreciate a good deed by a disbeliever but not a (allegedly) good deed by a believer thus disintegrates, because their good deed in actuality is not good; it is a reprehensible innovation. You tried to divert attention form the deed to the doer of the deed, and failed.
    2. The prophet commemorated the day of his birth, not the date. He never said “fast on 12. of rabuiawwal”, but simply used to fast on mondays; meaning, every monday of the week, not just the mondays or one monday in rabiulawwal. So, if you want to commemorate the birthday of the Prophet, s.a.w.s., the do it on the day he, s.a.w.s. did (monday) and the way he did it (by fasting).

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  13. Abd- Allah

    oh no, not the issue of abu lahab again… (sigh)

    quick question to those who use the “abu lahab dream” as proof to celebrate Mawlid, would everyone believe me if I said that I had a dream which says that we shouldn’t celebrate Mawlid?? Would people stop celebrating Mawlid then??

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  14. MR

    If MuslimMatters represents all Muslims then their should be at least a pro-Mawlid article…

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  15. Siraaj

    as-salamu ‘alaykum,

    Ibn Taymiyya (R) is not an authority on this matter, what of Ibn Kathir (R) who was once a student of Ibn Taymiyya and his acceptance of the Mawlid? There are more ulama past and present and more prominent and more widely accepted ulama than Ibn Taymiyya that have accepted the principle and practice of the Mawlid. The issue is a no-brainer really.

    To me, the no-brainer is the purpose of this article – to clarify ibn taymiyyah’s position on the mawlid – there are a large number of intellectually dishonest sufi-oriented websites which have gone to great lengths to prove that he supported this practice by leaving out the statements missed in the parenthetical remarks.

    Siraaj

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  16. Abd- Allah

    “If MuslimMatters represents all Muslims then their should be at least a pro-Mawlid article…”

    Brother MR, MuslimMatters only represents the few people involved with it, like authors and editors… Sure it targets a Muslim audience, but thats a different story. That is why there is a comments section, to voice your opinion. Many times I do not agree with what the article says, that is why you see me commenting so much. In reality, there hasn’t been any real articles against the Mawlid. This one was to clarify Ibn Taymiyah’s view, and the other ones were about the history of it. So don’t worry brother, we are being treated equally here and we both have the comments section to voice our opinions.

    I think Mawlid is bid’a!

    now its your turn, tell us what you think about Mawlid (smile)

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  17. Tayyab

    1. To the statement(s) that Ibn Taymiyyah is not an authority on the matter of mawlid…..if even the Sahaba were not free of error, how can any of us discard the opinion of any knowledgeable ‘alim who has thought and pondered on an issue based simply upon the fact that they are not as famous or celebrated as another ‘alim? Was there not a time when even the likes of Al Shafi’ and Abu Hanifa were but students? Look at the proofs, look at the argument, look at the content of what is being said.

    2. If that statement does not satisfy, then inshaAllah we can agree as many others have suggested that remembering the Prophet’s, saw, bday is fine but please do it in the way of the proof the proponents themselves provide….by fasting every Monday. Remove the songs, remove the tacky flashing Christmas lights, remove the processions.

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  18. Dawud Israel

    I hope this is an April Fools joke (Bidah!) because I think we got the idea…like 10 times over…already! It seems the hobby of practicing Muslims is to bicker about these things, well their children go out clubbing and drinking. We need to get our priorities straight, especially if there is a difference of opinion among the scholars!

    I posted the following on a forum earlier and I’ll re-post it here now. Do consider, regardless of your views. Every year, we do this song and dance, so as far as I see it, people who argue about (for or against) mawlids just celebrate it in their own way. That is, arguing IS how they celebrate mawlids:

    It’s a consequence of ignorance and lack of knowledge that people start engage in debates when they have nothing better to do. None of us really has any knowledge if we compare it to the generations that came before. Why must then people turn religion into something to debate?

    It’s not enough to respect and trust in the scholars of this ummah- now and in the 1400 years we have survived, but we must debate it. Why? What is the hikmah behind this? It’s always been stated clearly that BOTH opinions must be respected- both for or against the mawlid…and yet, “NO we must debate it out!”

    Enough is enough. These needless debates are a curse on this ummah. How many hours have been wasted on this. How little have people benefited! When fools have nothing better to do they start arguing and debating. They are a reason why this ummah is suffering and a reason why Muslims know more about arguing than about their own deen! What is the end result of such ignorance? Of people whose Islam is little more than propaganda, brainwashing and demonizing (on ALL sides)?

    It’s hatred. And it results in death threats on our shaykhs. And dividing the ummah so you can’t do this because they are this. You can’t attend that masjid because I saw them do this. Or that conference, because they have this person speaking. The Sunnah is only what you want it to be…the result is ghaflah. I don’t care what a person’s opinion is on this issue- BUT what angers me to no end is pushing people to debate, argue and bicker about it. This is the work of shaytaan.

    We don’t need any more of this garbage. We need to learn about our Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam NOT hatred. We need to learn to respect our shuyookh and their differences in opinion. If a person takes offense at hearing one shaykh’s opinion (whichever shaykh) then that is his problem- don’t make it everyone else’s problem. Even if we don’t follow another shaykhs opinion, we should respect the difference of opinion. This is something we need to learn.

    We don’t need any more flame wars.

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  19. ibnabeeomar

    dawud – you complain about lack of knowledge, but you want to abandon these debates at the same time. as long as the article itself is written with proper adab (which i believe it is) – then isn’t it helping to alleviate that very ignorance that is the root cause of the problems you mention?

    to shove the issue aside and not discuss it would seem to actually compound the problem.

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  20. Mostafa

    As salaamu ulaykum,

    It’s ironic brother dawud israel. Your the only one “bickering”. If you’re going about talk love for our Prophet (Sallalahu ‘Aleyhi Wasallam), atleast use his manners when discussing something.

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  21. IbnAbbas

    Assalaamu a’laikum

    Jazakumullah Khairan shaykh Ali for appearing after a long time. keep them coming INSHALLAH.

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  22. AsimG

    Dawud,
    You have a very good point.
    May Allah reward you for your intentions.

    But…
    Your post was not appropriate on the other MM nor is it appropriate on this MM,especially since you are basically calling out Shaykh Ali as an IGNORANT FOOL (you didn’t edit the post enough).

    I say this to myself FIRST AND FOREMOST:
    we need to be more careful about what we post. One of my friends would make istikhara before addressing controversial issues online and would take so many steps to avoid fitnah and insulting people. If only I had half of his adab…

    Even if you are in the right and the issue is clear-cut, there is no benefit in insulting your brothers. And I can assure you that your post, even though I know it wasn’t your intention, was VERY insulting.

    So insha’Allah let us be more careful.

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  23. AsimG

    Also jazakullah khair Shaykh Ali,

    I was really confused about Ibn Taimiyyah’s position earlier and alhamdillah this made things more clear. I wish the timing was better so people don’t get this feeling of anti-mawlid overdrive, but alhamdillah at any time :)

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  24. Osman ibn Rasib

    ‘It has been narrated that once Ibn Taimiyyah was walking with his students when they came across some drunken Mongol soldiers. In his time, the Mongolians had invaded the Muslim lands, including Iraq where he was born, and they had decimated these lands with a degree of killing heretofore never seen.’

    Ibn Taymiyyah (may Allah have mercy on him) was born in Harran, Turkey (not Iraq).

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  25. J

    Jazak Dr. Ali for an extremely enlightening post as usual…. It reaaly breaks my heart to see the complete and utter disrespect some people have towards you. Inshallah i know this will not deter you, as i’m sure you only are seeking the pleasure of Allah swt. However i myself have never heard of you either yet each of your articles has only increased my love for this deen and for you as well for the sake of Allah. May Allah reward you immensely.

    J

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  26. J

    This is the work of shaytaan.
    We don’t need any more of this garbage. We need to learn about our Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam NOT hatred. We need to learn to respect our shuyookh and their differences in opinion.

    I love the irony in that statement……

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    • Amad

      I think Dawud just cut and paste something from another forum… I don’t believe he was addressing Dr. Ali Shehata with the comment about “work of shaytan, garbage”, etc. I don’t know him to be like that, though it is important to be careful in cutting and pasting precisely because context matters.

      Dawud, you should clarify your position because if you were indeed addressing Dr. Ali, then your comment would be unacceptable on MM, as we are very careful in respecting people of knowledge, regardless of their ideology.

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  27. J

    It’s not enough to respect and trust in the scholars of this ummah- now and in the 1400 years we have survived, but we must debate it. Why? What is the hikmah behind this? It’s always been stated clearly that BOTH opinions must be respected- both for or against the mawlid…and yet, “NO we must debate it out!”

    Where exactly has that clearly been stated? And if this was true, than why exactly is it still debated?

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  28. MA

    Assalam-alaikum Br.
    To circle back the statement of a brother

    .”..quick question to those who use the “abu lahab dream” as proof to celebrate Mawlid, would everyone believe me if I said that I had a dream which says that we shouldn’t celebrate Mawlid?? Would people stop celebrating Mawlid then??..”

    Brother why you had a doubt that people won’t….after having confimed how pious and extra deligent Sh. al Bukhari was in collecting the hadiths. And his book most authentic book next to Quraan and then again having passed soo many scholars through decades. So question on the table be if one is tacitly underming the certain section (obviously the section one like) of Sahih alBukhari (nauBillah) or inisisting on certain revelation to come for one convey. Which is a serious mistake per-se..

    Obviously that point missed is ….. not to reflect on the hadith when asked why do you fast oh Mohammed Salalahu-alaihiWasallam..” ………That is the day that I was born and that is the day I received the prophecy.” the very wording….”…That is the day that I was born…. from the mouth of Prohpet SWT isn’t enough to make that day special.and we lowerd ourself to an extent that we are having a argument about – gathering few moments to reflect on life of the most beloved Prohpet of Allah SWT……

    May Allah open our heart to the love of Prophet SWT. Ameen.

    Jazakallah
    MA

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  29. Abu Abdul

    Salam,

    You know, the deen of Allaah is not emotional but factual. Its not what I like or feels like but what Allaah and His prophet like. So, to know what Allaah and His prophet like, you ask the religious scholars. When they differ, then seek their evidences and traceability of opinion to the earliest generation. How misleading, to conclude that every disagreement among the scholars is a leeway for the acceptance of all conflicting views.

    To the brother(s) chastising the one who commands good and forbid evils; doing this daily or yearly, is not overflogging of issues but a rewardable act. We need to be reminded as the hearts are forgetful and lax. May Allaah reward Br Ali for your insightful analysis. It sure throws light to the doubt. Mind you, your job is only to present the truth, as you cannot force people to accept this. For every truth seekers, they will always find the truth bi ithni llaahi, and for those who seek to gratify the desires, they will feed their desires bi ithni llaahi, May Allaah make us amongst the first.

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  30. Abu Ninja

    To all those who celebrate the Mawlid, a few questions I ask,

    1. Did Abu Bakr Siddiq [RA] ever celebrate the birthday of the Prophet (saw) in his entire life?

    2. Did Umar Ibn Khattab [RA] ever celebrate the birthday of the Prophet (saw) in his entire life?

    3. Did Uthmaan Ibn Affan [RA] ever celebrate the birthday of the Prophet (saw) in his entire life?

    4. Did Ali Ibn Abi Talib [RA] ever celebrate the birthday of the Prophet (saw) in his entire life?

    5. In fact, did ANY Companion of the Prophet [SAW] ever celebrate the birthday of the Prophet (saw) in their life?

    6. Moving on, did ANY of the great Imams of the Salaf like, Imam Saeed al-Mussayab, Imam Sufyan ath-Thawri, Imam Abdullah Ibn Mubarak, Imam Abu Hanifa, Imam Malik or Imam Shafi’ee and Imam Ahmed Ibn Hanbal, EVER celebrate the birthday of the Prophet [SAW]??

    The answer to all above questions is without ANY doubt.. NO.

    Thats why we choose to follow the way of the Salaf-us-Saliheen [Pious Predecessors], and those who celebrate the Mawlid, choose to leave off following the way of the best of generations. Those who had the MOST knowledge of the Sunnah. As the Prophet [SAW] said,

    “The best of generations is my generation (Sahabah), then those who come after them (Tabi’een), and then those who come after them (Taba-Tabi’een).” [Bukhari & Muslim]

    So why leave off following the best generations??

    Also we find some people come and post about Muslim unity and lets leave off the disease of debate etc, but these SAME people, when you visit their own websites, you find articles upon articles attacking the people of the Sunnah, those who choose to follow the way of the Salaf. See the hypocrisy!

    Once I was speaking to one of the biggest Sufi scholars from Pakistan about the Mawlid, who was quoting ayaats from the Qur’an and hadith upon hadith trying to prove that celebrating the Mawlid was legitimate and recommended in Islam. I asked him a simple question,

    “Who had more love and knowledge of the Qur’an and Sunnah, the Companions of the Messenger of Allah or you people who celebrate the Mawlid? BECAUSE if in actual fact all those ayaats and hadiths you quoted were in reality proof of celebrating the Mawlid, then WHY didnt ANY of the Sahabah EVER celebrate the Birthday of the Prophet [SAW]?? Were they ignorant of the actual meanings of those ayaats and sayings of the Prophet? Or did they choose to ignore those hadiths and ayaats intentionally?”

    What was his reply, something that silenced me, He said,

    “IF there was a sahih hadith, related in Bukhari, by Abu Bakr, saying you shouldn’t celebrate the birthday of the Prophet [SAW], we would even REJECT that hadith, because Allah tells us in the Qur’an to be happy that the Prophet [SAW] came!”

    Now anyone with SOME ilm and sincerity can see the MAJOR flaws and mistakes in that argument. An this answer was given by one of the biggest sufi scholars in the whole of Pakistan, who regularly travels the world giving lectures at packed out venues.

    At the end of the day, those who wish to celebrate the birthday of the Prophet [SAW] despite none of the Sahabah, Tabi’een or Taba-Tabi’een ever having celebrated it, can continue following the practice of Abu Lahab, we ask Allah to guide them, and WE will InshaAllah continue following the way of the Salaf, the best of generations.

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  31. MA

    Assalama-alaikum Br.
    For those who feel comfort in asking questions about who in the Sahaba has celeberated Mawlid .. etc etc. should go back and defind the celeberation it-self? Moreover they should also clarify that its NOT just the act of sahaba and tabaEeen that are permitted in Islam (else we would have to give up all cars and other comfort) and go back to those days of hardship. But we had a total system – a Sharia that define what is right and wrong within the boundaries of Islam. And one also needs bring to the table that Sharia is not just the Quraan and Sunna but also includes (1)- Ijmaa (2) IjtaHaad. As mentioned before which hadith a person needs( well not being emotional) to make the birth-day a special one… other then the words of Muhammed salal-la-huAlaihuwa-sallam. ..himself said “….That is the day that I was born and that is the day I received the prophecy…” isn’t enough to put aside all the arguments. But again there are few who insist that needs a revelation to be convyed…. ”

    “…May Allah help us to understand the deen they way HE want us to understand ..only then..we will be able to worship Allah and follow his commands the way HE want us to follow…Ameen”

    Jazakallah
    MA

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  32. Musleh

    The Mawlid will ive on forever, inshallah. Scholars from all sides of the spectrum, ibn Hajar, Ibn Taymiyyah, Ibn Kathir, Imam Suyuti, have commended such an action. They knew better than all you amatuers here. YouTube scholars are no authoroty on this matter.

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  33. S

    Mawlid by Ibn Kathir (ra) is going to be published soon

    mashAllah he wrote a whole booklet on it.

    Hope you all buy it

    Share the love,

    S

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  34. Abd- Allah

    Thank you brother MA for proving my point, that this group ofpeople who celebrate the Mawlid have a flawed understanding of this deen. You consider a car to be like the Mawlid? The Mawlid is an act of WORSHIP while the car is not. Besides, even if we agree in equating the two, cars=Mawlid, the car has a basis from the time of the prophet peace be upon him, which were camels and horses, but the Mawlid still has no basis.

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  35. Umm Ismael

    Asslam u alaikum wr wb
    MashaALLAH, A well researched article written in good taste. Gives us a lot to ponder upon specially the aspect dealing with “humility”. JazakALLAH Khair

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  36. AsimG

    yo brothers and sisters,

    Can we stop the pro/anti-mawlid comments now?

    Just comment on Ibn Taimiyya’s position or don’t post at all.

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  37. Dawud Israel

    Amad: Yeah, I just copy-pasted to add a third voice…it’s nothing personal on Ali Shehata or anything like that. Apologies, if any ill-will was interpreted towards him, he seems like cool guy…so yeah, most of my comment was directed at the commentators, regardless of which side they are tooting for.

    A lot of us, are just plain tired of this debate…we got more important things to deal with. Sure, I understand the points about Ibn Taymiyyah may be great, but, are they RELEVANT to our situation? Are they a priority? What will happen next after this article and what will it lead to realistically speaking? What was he expecting to happen as a result of his article? That is all I think I would want Ali Shehata to consider, if he hasn’t already. If he has, then alhamdulillah, I support him. :)

    Now, ya’ll know someone is just going to counter this, (with Ibn Kathir’s stance on mawlid or whoever) and then counter that, and then counter…forever. Such and such is for mawlid, and such and such isn’t…ok great. Big deal. SO WHAT? We’ve discussed to death what happens on one day out of the 365 in the year…now what about the other 365? It becomes kind of futile in the end and is going to be a debate repeated by the future generation…so how about we direct our attention on what is more beneficial, to what holds more promise of changing our condition, to something good we can leave for the future generations?

    What I am trying to get across is, perhaps, that argumentation is also one of the reasons why we have killed off so many sunnahs…we are so pre-occupied on this, but forget that the sunnah is something we all agree on. Let’s focus on that? Compare the amount of argumentation that happens…with the amount of sunnahs that are revived and you’ll see what I am getting at. If we spent maybe half the amount of energy we spend on debates…on reviving the sunnah, then this debate would never have occurred.

    Maybe give this whole topic a cold shoulder for a while and build up our Islam so that once we are stronger in the deen, this topic won’t even be an issue nor even a debate. Don’t let debates control this ummah…let the Shariah (in it’s entirety, and not just certain parts of it).

    That’s all.

    P.S. To all the hot-shots, look up how often the Sahabas argued, how often Rasulullah salallahu alayhi wasalam argued and bickered, and then you’ll realize they looked down upon it.

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  38. AsimG

    Did anyone ACTUALLY read the last part of Shaykh Ali’s article?

    Scroll back up and read the awesome words of Ibn Taimiyya (again).

    “And many of those who censure others in regards to innovations either in worship or traditions, you find them deficient in practicing some acts from the Sunnah in these two categories or in encouraging others to do them. And indeed it may even be that their condition is worse than some of those who are practicing these innovations that are tainted with some degree of dislike (makruh). For the religion is to command good and to forbid evil and neither of these two takes precedence over the other. So one should not forbid an evil without commanding a good to take its place in the same way that we call people to the worship of Allah alone after having forbid them from worshipping others beside Him.”

    And also read what Shaykh Ali wrote:
    “It is not enough to simply forbid someone from a deed, but we should help them to replace what they were upon of innovation or disobedience with something from the Quran and Sunnah thereby reviving the practice of the Prophet (saas) and killing off the evils. Also, we must remember that humility is a great part of righteousness and this entails the assumption that the one to whom we are speaking is better than us. Even though they may have erred and been swept up by a certain innovation or temptation from the evils of the world, it may be that they are more sincere than us and practice more of the Sunnah elsewhere than us. This is why Ibn Taimiyyah humbly hoped that Allah would reward them, for who knows what innovations we may unknowingly be practicing or even worse, if we have some hidden shirk within our hearts. This was among the reasons the Prophet (saas) used to encourage us with the following du’a which he taught to Abu Bakr (ra):”

    *wonders if anyone will even read what I reposted or just go back into their ideological warfare*

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  39. MA

    Assalam-alaikum Br…

    Anyhow brothers that point was NOT car=mawlid as Br.AsimG & Br.Abd- Allah pointed …. it was an allegory to get the point across. Well the point was
    Islam=Sharia ( which include Quraan, Sunnah, Ijmaa and Isthaad)
    NOT just whether it has done by a sahaba/compainion as been potrayed/understood by some. So for an act to be right or wrong should be decided by applying the islamic principles..

    And …AGAIN ..the point that was missed ..
    “….Prophet(may Allahs blessings and peace be upon him) was asked about the fast of Monday, and he answered: “THAT IS THE DAY THAT I WAS BORN and that is the day I received the prophecy.”…..

    Does those wording (“THAT IS THE DAY THAT I WAS BORN) conveys anything..to true lover of Muhammed Salalahu-alaihiWasallam… but an importance of the day? Well I will let you name that day..whatever you want.. insha-allah.

    Jazakallah
    MA

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  40. J

    I am not the same J as the one who posted above (and it kind of irks me that someone else is using my screen-name, although to be fair, J is not exactly the most unique of screen-names).

    Anyways, I think this article is great. Jazakh-Allah Khair. I also think that it shows the deceitfulness of the Sufi websites that take Ibn Taymiyyah’s quote way out of context to present as a proof.

    P.S. How do we register a screen-name???

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  41. AsimG

    you don’t unless you are an author.

    So you could post as AsimG and pretend to represent me.

    MA,
    There is an answer to your statement, but aren’t you tired of debating this?
    I am…

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  42. Abd- Allah

    Brother MA,
    next time you try to get a point across, just say the point instead of making irrelevant analogies.
    Islam is what the prophet and his companions did and how they practiced islam. Don’t you think that if there was any good in celebrating the Mawlid then the companions would have done it before us?

    “Well I will let you name that day..whatever you want”
    I will call that day “Monday”, because that is what it is called, and that is what the prophet peace be upon him called it, Monday.

    Yes, the day the prophet was born is important, but that doesn’t mean we can do things that the prophet himself never did or commanded us to do.

    But brother, if you want to stick to celebrating the Mawlid, then you should be consistent and celebrate all the prophets’ birthdays, right?
    Allah created Adam alayhi assalam on Friday, and according to the prophet peace be upon him, Friday is the greatest of all days to Allah, and it is even greater than the day of Adha and the day of Fitr. So come on, be consistent, pick a Friday during the year and make a Mawlid.

    There is no such thing as a “good” bid’a or bid’a “hasanah”. Whoever told you so has lied to you.

    The best of guidance is the guidance of prophet Muhammad peace be upon him, and every innovation is a bid’a, and every bid’a is a misguidance, and every misguidance is in hell fire. Key word: Every.

    {Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): If ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.} (3:31)

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  43. Mustafa

    Did anyone else understand that the main point of this article was not to disprove the Mawlid, but to show what Ibn Taymiyyah’s real stance was on this issue and refute any notion that he supported it? I don’t think Dr. Ali was meaning to rehash the centuries-old debate for or against mawlid celebrations, but to show that those who are FOR them simply cannot use Ibn Taymiyyah to support their position. Hayyakallah Dr. Ali

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  44. Maz

    I’ll will continue to observe Maulid. I say salam to the Prophet everyday. But on on Maulid I say extra. I try to recall all the hardships he went through. I use the occasion to share more stories about him with my children. Those who don’t celebrate maulid, that’s fine. But if you do, I think that fine too.

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  45. SA

    alhamdulillah this was a very beneficial article… jazakallah khayr Dr. Ali for posting

    i learned not only about Ibn Taiymiyyah’s actual position on the mawlid, but also about his ikhlaaq towards the muslims

    Narrated ‘Abdullah bin ‘Amr:
    The Prophet (saw) never used bad language neither a “Fahish nor a Mutafahish. He used to say “The best amongst you are those who have the best manners and character.” (Bukhari)

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  46. Ali Shehata

    Salaam alaikum

    J - Thank you for your kind words … this website has thickened my skin a lot and the personal attacks don’t bother me now as much as they used to; but your love is appreciated and indeed reciprocated, may Allah gather us together in His shade as those who love one another for His sake.

    Mostafa – Thank you as well, I am glad that someone actually read the whole article and understood that its purpose was mainly to clarify what Ibn Taymiyyah really thought (hence the title) :-) may Allah reward you dear brother for your kindness and join us in Jannah – ameen

    Dawud – Your other comments aside for the moment, I think you need to reread the article and its clearly stated purpose before you wrecklessly cut and paste or add your own words. The post never stated that it was for or against the Mawlid and my emphasis in fact was what you tried to somewhat represent in your posts, that respect and kindness to each other must come first. Thus my objective and what I “hoped to achieve” as you put it was nothing more than to clarify what it was that Ibn Taimiyyah said and what his opinion was and to appreciate that even though he was personally against the Mawlid, he was still gentle with those who did celebrate it and prayed for them. I do think that this is relevant to our situation since the article focused on how to handle the opposite view – and if it isn’t relevant then maybe you can explain why it isn’t. You ask what I hope the article will accomplish – the hope is that we will learn to deal with each other as brothers and to be more respectful, but again you can read the article to get the full effect.

    I would encourage you and anyone else to carefully read what others are saying, then stop for a few moments and make sure you understand clearly what is being said and then if necessary to comment. It seems very common on this site that people carelessly comment on issues without seeming to have fully read each point which results in further animosity and bad manners. Your initial comment was quite lengthy to this regards but it seems that you violated your own words in that regards and as your brother who wishes good for you, I would recommend that you be a little slower to comment next time and be sure that your words are needed before writing them.

    And lastly – for those who continuously keep using the hadith about the Prophet (saas) referring to Monday as the day of his birth, then I would encourage that you go back to the commentaries on the hadith to get the full picture. Many of you are interpreting it the way that you see it without having knowledge of its circumstances and how it was understood by those who DID hear it from his blessed lips (saas). This is why we weren’t chosen to be his Companions and why Allah chose those who were far better than us to be his companions. It is very important that we take both Quranic ayaat and ahadith in the proper context and not just to open the book and to make up our own opinions regarding what we see with our untrained eyes. This is a very large doorway to much greater sins and to absolute misguidance. You find once again that the Companions did not like to comment on either an ayah or a hadith unless they firmly understood them and this is a lesson we should all benefit from and apply in our own approach which will demonstrate both our respect to this deen and our respect to those who preceded us in faith and righteousness.

    And Allah knows best

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  47. QasYM

    Jazakallah Sh. Ali for that. It seems like 80% of the people that have replied have yet to actually read the original post and understand the reason it was written.

    @ Those who say the Sahaba never celebrated the birthday of the Prophet (saw). They did! And here’s how they did it. When asked why he (saw) fasted on Monday’s “That is the day I was born and the day the first Revelation was sent down on me.” (Muslim)

    Let’s revive this Sunnah and encourage those of our brothers and sisters who do actions on “the mawlid” contrary to the Sunnah to also do what the SAHABA and the Prophet (saw) himself did. Sadly those who are extreme in celebrating the mawlid don’t even know about this.

    @ Those who are questioning the authority of Shaykhul Islam Ibn Taymiyyah, the main reason for this article (I believe) was for those who practice the “the Mawlid” and USE him as evidence for doing so. Those who celebrate the mawlid are the ones who resort to taking quotes of Ibn Taymiyyah and using them out of context.

    So you should actually ask THEM, why THEY use Ibn Taymiyyah to celebrate the milad un-nabi.

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  48. MA

    Ironically citiation given by Sh. Ali to the standing of Shaykhul Islam Ibn Taymiyyah regards to celeberation of Muhammed -Salalahu-alaikhiWa-Sallam birthday are more milder that people who are using his (Shaykhul Islam Ibn Taymiyyah) quotes

    Doesn’t matter whatever one call his (Muhammed -Salalahu-alaikhiWa-Sallam) birthday Mauwlid or Monday (as name picked by Abd-Allah – see above comments) the point is His (salalahu-alaikhiWa-Sallam) birthday is important event in islamic and one is oblighed’ reviev the Sunnah by fasting on Monday. Well being a muslim – as Allah SWT mentioned – one (we) don’t differentiate between prohpets so we shouldn’t. If one want to pay homeage to Adam alaihis-salaam … or Musa alaihWa-salaam… why not.. insha-allah. But atleast let’s start with Monday as we are the ummAti of Muhammed salalahu-alaikhiWa-Sallam.

    Jazzakallah..

    MA

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  49. Abd- Allah

    Brother MA, Alhamdulilah you agree that reviving the sunnah is by fasting Mondays and not by celebrating Mawlid once a year which is not from the sunnah. You see, from the people i personally know, most of the ones who follow the sunnah correctly (who don’t celebrate Mawlid) have been fasting on Mondays, but on the other hand many of the ones who i know that celebrate Mawlid, I rarely see them fasting on Mondays. That shows that the people who claim that they celebrate Mawlid out of love of the prophet peace be upon him, should start first by fasting on Mondays and following his true sunnah. Once they start fasting on Mondays, then they can argue that they want to do more to celebrate the prophet’s birthday like do Mawlid.

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  50. J. Ibrahim

    Jazak Allaah Khair Ali for that wonderful summary.

    This level-mindedness is part of the reason why I truly love this shaykh (Ibn Taymiyyah). I pray that more Muslims can be so fair when dealing with others and recognize with wisdom the evil that their “enjoining good” (that is with harsh terms and actions that repel others rather than draw them in) may bring.

    wasalaam,
    Ibrahim

    Sacramento, Ca

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  51. IAZ

    Assalaamu ‘alaikum,

    Can someone provide a reference for Ibn ‘Abbaas RA statement quoted in the article:

    “Never will a year come to pass except that its people will invent in it an innovation and kill thereby a Sunnah until the innovation is established and the Sunnah dies off.”

    Is it in Ibn Taymiyyah’s RA book?

    JazakumAllahu Khairan

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  52. Abd- Allah

    Wa Alaikum Assalam Warahmatullah,
    brother IAZ, this statement of Ibn Abbas may Allah be pleased with him is found in the following books:

    1) Usul Assunnah by Ibn Zamanayn.

    2) Assunnah by Abi Nasr.

    3) Al- ibaanah by Ibn Batta.

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  53. J

    This level-mindedness is part of the reason why I truly love this shaykh (Ibn Taymiyyah). I pray that more Muslims can be so fair when dealing with others and recognize with wisdom the evil that their “enjoining good” (that is with harsh terms and actions that repel others rather than draw them in) may bring.

    The Sufis will never be ok with us until we are SO mild that we do not censure them at all for going to mawlid. They want to limit it to a “difference of opinion”, which will allow them to continue this bidah, and continue calling to it.

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  54. Abd- Allah

    “The Sufis will never be ok with us until we are SO mild that we do not censure them at all for going to mawlid. They want to limit it to a “difference of opinion”, which will allow them to continue this bidah, and continue calling to it.”

    Brother J, I disagree, the sufis will never be ok with us until we become sufi ourselves. The first step maybe that they want us to stop talking about how they do innovations and shirk, but if they get us to do that and stop censuring them for the wrong things that they do, then their next step is to call us to their ways so that we become sufi too. They will never be satisfied until all the muslims are sufis.

    The main problem is that they are calling other people to their innovations. I have seen it several times where a sufi brother invites a brother who have recently accepted islam and became muslim, and he takes him to a sufi zikr halaqah or “sohbet” and this new muslim brother comes back thinking this is crazy and if this is islam then I don’t want to be a muslim, because of all the crazy stuff they do like yelling “hu hu hu” which has no meaning. So this drives the new muslim brother away from islam thinking that if this is islam then he doesn’t want to be a muslim.

    So to all the sufis out there, please leave people alone, especially if they have just accepted islam, don’t just jump on them and try to make them sufis. Give them some time to atleast learn the basics and know what islam really is.

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  55. sadiq

    Br Abd-Allah, please actually study and read about tasawwuf (sufism) before making irresponsible and inaccurate statements like the above.

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  56. Abd- Allah

    Brother sadiq, I don’t mean to brag or to put you down, but I probably know more about tasawwuf than you do. Sufis fall into two categories, those who know the truth but don’t accept it, and those who are sincere but are ignorant and don’t know any better so they follow the first group who misleads them.

    Although the different sects of sufis are not all the same in beliefs and practices, but none of them is free of innovations and shirk.

    I don’t know to which tariqah you associate with specifically, but here are a few of the major things that should stand out as red flags to any muslim, whether it is the shirk that they do, or the innovations that they do, to the fabricated hadiths that they attribute to the prophet peace be upon him:

    Naqshbend, the founder of the Nakshbendi sufi order, said the following: “I have disbelieved in the religion of Allah, and disbeleiving is obligatory.” (Almawahib Assarmadiyyah, p: 162)

    Alkaramani Alyamani, one of the sufi sheikhs, said: “when we say the creation, we mean the creator, and when we say the rock, we mean Allah.” (Masra’ Attasawwuf, p: 196)

    Habib Ali Jiffri, a current sufi sheikh, leads a gathering of people in singing: “In you (O Muhammad) is the image of Ar-Rahman (Allah).” (There is a video of this on youtube for those who do not believe me. There are videos of him that show him quoting hadiths which he claims to be from Sahih Bukhari, but in reality if you check Sahih Bukhari you will not find the hadith that he mentioned there. As the prophet peace be upon him says that one of the three signs of a hypocrite is that if he speaks, he lies. Relating fabricated hadiths seems to be Jiffri’s hobby. He even made the false claim that there is consensus among the scholars that the prophet’s grave is better and greater than the throne of Allah!)

    Many sufis believe in wihdat alwujud, or Pantheism which is the view that everything is part of an all-encompassing immanent God. This is obviously not part of islam!

    Most sufi sheikhs go to graves of righteous people and make du’a ASKING the dead person to help them out. Du’a is a form of worship, as the prophet peace be upon him says in an authentic hadith: “du’a is worship”. So when these sufis go to graves and make du’a and ask the dead people instead of asking Allah, then they are committing shirk and worshiping others with Allah. There is no proof of this from the sunnah, and ALL the hadiths that they use to justify what they do are either fabricated or very weak. The last time I visited a sufi website that has “proof” that tasawwuf is from the sunnah, they had about 13 hadiths to support the innovations that they do, but once I looked these hadiths up in the books of hadith, I found out that many of them were fabricated, and the rest were very weak, except one hadith was authentic and it had no proof or evidence to actually support the innovations and shirk that they do. So if these people are using fabricated hadiths to try and support the innovations that they do, then how can anyone trust them and learn islamic knowledge from them?!

    Here are some excerpts taken from the website (http://www.sheiknazim2.com/sufism.html) of the biggest sufi (naqshbendi) sheikh alive today:

    “Sheikh Nazim
    THE POWER OF THE SHEIKH surrounds and ENCOMPASSES THE WHOLE WORLD IN THE LAND OR IN THE SEAS AND IN EVERY PLACE” (If this is the power of their sheikh, then I wonder what they left for Allah?!)

    “There are some mureeds who have been given the gift by Mowlana Sheikh Nazim of
    being able to see the Holy Prophet Muhammad (Sal) appearing before them. To
    some of them the Holy Prophet (Sal) appears to them in flashes. Some are in the
    presence of the Holy Prophet (Sal) at all times – 24 hours a day. They are able to
    communicate with the Holy Prophet (Sal). They are able to put questions to Holy
    Prophet Muhammad (Sal) and they are answered by him. The Holy Prophet
    Muhammad (Sal) teaches, instructs and guides them.” (The one who takes drugs starts imagining things…)

    “The existence of Seyyidina Mahdi (Alai) in these times is doubly confirmed by some
    mureeds of Mowlana Sheik Nazim who have been given the gift of seeing Seyyidina
    Mahdi (Alai). He is so powerful that it is not possible for people to look at his eyes.
    Mowlana Sheikh Nazim has however, granted some of his mureeds the power to look
    directly into the eyes of Seyyidina Mahdi (Alai) and also to communicate with him.”

    “Certain of the mureeds of Mowlana Sheikh Nazim experience that Mowlana appears
    within them. When this happens, they are no longer conscious of themselves as
    themselves. They loose their identity and are conscious of themselves as their
    Sheikh. They see through Mowlana’s eyes when they look, they hear through
    Mowlana’s ears when they speak. They no longer see or feel themselves as they no
    longer exist, only Mowlana exists.”

    “Some mureeds also experience the state of “Fana fi Rasool” which is the next stage
    towards the Divine Presence. In this stage the Holy Prophet (Sal) is experienced
    within the mureed. As in the earlier case the mureeds lose their identity and are
    conscious of themselves as Mowlana Sheikh Nazim who is lost in the Holy Prophet
    Muhammad (Sal). They can no longer identify themselves as themselves. They now
    identify themselves while in this state as being mirrored by the Holy Prophet
    Muhammad (Sal). They now see, hear and experience sensation through the Holy
    Prophet (Sal).”

    “Abu Yazid al-Bistami (one of the greatest Masters of the Khwajagan line) approached
    the Divine Presence and “knocked on the gate”. He was asked, “Who is there?” “I
    have come, Oh my Lord”, replied Abu Yazid. He was told: “There isn’t any place here
    for two. Leave your ego behind and come”. When Abu Yazid once again approached
    the Divine Presence and was asked who it was, he said: “You, oh Lord”.”

    “Sometimes, mureeds have been transported to other countries and places. For
    example they may be transported in a moment to London where Mowlana Sheikh
    Nazim would be delivering a lecture. Some are known to have visited Mecca, Medina,
    London and Baghdad in moments by the power and the grace of Mowlana Sheikh
    Nazim.”

    “Mowlana Sheikh Nazim says that the purpose of religion is to know Allah. He quotes
    the Hadith Qudsi “I was a Hidden Treasure and loved to be known” (Abd- Allah: btw, this is a FABRICATED hadith!!). Therefore the purpose of any religion is to find this Hidden Treasure and to discover its secrets. It is
    towards this end that Mowlana Sheikh Nazim is training his mureeds. He guides them
    to the Divine Presence and seats them on the Divine Throne of Allah Almighty to take
    command of the entire Universe.”

    “The next stage is the realization of Allah’s
    omnipotence and our weakness. This realization inspires awe in the face of the
    majesty and might of Allah (Jalal), and one feels himself a most humble servant of a
    Most Transcendent Lord. Beyond this is the stage of intimacy (uns) at which the
    immanence of the Lord is perceived:
    “And I am closer to man than his jugular vein”
    At this stage one perceives His aspects of love and beauty (Jamal). But the ultimate
    goal is beyond even the intimacy of “I and Thou”, a Unity beyond duality, for He is All
    in All. That is the meaning of, “There is no God but He”.”

    “The Lord Almighty will accept your existence and give of Himself. That is the meaning
    of “Fanafillah” (annihilation in Allah) and Baqabillah (permanence in Allah): real
    existence in the Ocean of Unity of Allah Almighty.”

    “This has nothing to do with our own will, but it is the will of the Sheikh, who
    is taking from the presence of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (sal). The Sheikh is always
    with the presence of the Prophet Muhammad (sal) whose reality is always with Allah
    (without there being any direction or place for this).”

    “Then you may see the Reality of the Sheikh, whose power is
    surrounding the whole world (if he is a true one!). There are no borders. No. Not if the
    responsibility has been given to him, officially, by the Holy Prophet (sal). His power is
    always present, in every place, on the land and in the Oceans. Wherever you go he is
    present. ”

    “This is the highest point of what Rasoolullah (sal), the seal of prophets, was trying to
    teach people. Allah’s existence is from eternal up to pre-eternal. There is no one
    except Him. In existence there is only Allah. There is nothing else. Wahid un Ahad (the
    Unique, the One). There is no existence except for Him. What are we? We are
    nothing. As for him who is declaring an existence for himself, he is making partnership
    to Allah (shirk).”

    ————————————————————————————————————-

    So brother sadiq, before you accuse me of not knowing anything about tasawwuf, maybe you are the one who needs to learn more about the sheikhs that you follow and about the way in which you practice your religion. Now (I hope) you might say that you don’t believe in all this and this is crazy, but the fact remains that your sheikh and the ones you are learning your islam from do believe in all this none-sense and they in turn are teaching you corrupt beliefs and teaching you innovations while claiming that they are sunnah! For example, your sheikh might have told you that Allah is everywhere. In the Quran, Allah says that He is above His throne. Now who would you believe, what your sheikh says by interpreting the Quran in his own twisted way, or what Allah says in the Quran clearly and explicitly? Now it is up to you to accept the reality that these sufi sheikhs have gone off the straight path and what they practice and teach is very far away from islam, or you can stay in denial of the truth and of reality and you will find out the truth on the day of judgement when it is too late.

    It is unfortunate that the sufi sheikhs are misleading many sincere muslims who have no idea what sufism really is, and so these sheikhs misguide their followers into committing innovations and shirk without them even knowing.

    May Allah guide us all.

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  57. MA

    Assalam-alaikum

    On the authority of Abu Huraira Radiallah Anhu who said the messenger of Allah Sallahu-alaihiWaSallam. ” Allah , the Exalted has said: Whosoever shows enimity to the friend of Mine, I shall be at war with him. My slave does not draw near to Me with anything more loved by Me than the religious duties I have imposed upon him, and My slave continues to draw near to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. When I love him <p. I am his hearing with which he hears , his seeing with which he see, his hand with which he holds and his foot with which he walks. Were he to as something of Me I would surely give it to him and were he to as Me for refuge I would surely grant him it al-Bukhari

    Br. Abd-Allah if the above hadith is too cryptic for you to understand then I believe relam of Zuhud (Tassawuf) isn’t for you. Buf if you do then you need to go deeper to understand what the words mean rather that taking the literal meaning. As presented above the synopsis of the statements of scholars and there literal interprations. What made you think that Allah mercy cannot showers to anyone in this current world. .. and who is capable of even thnking of dictating to Him (Nauzubillah) to whom to grant the Maarifa or not. As one can recollect the story of Musa Alihussalaam…when He (Musa Alihiwasalaam) proclamined to be the most knowledgable of all while Allah SWT said it is not Him (Musa alihisAlaam)- but Khidar aliHiWas Salaam .. even though He (Al-Khidar AliiWasalaam ) isn’t a prophet. What one can see is the apparent things like – Salaat / Hajj etc and it only few chosen one (maariF. by Allah Subhana-walaTaalah) that can Elm Gayaab (by will of Allah). In retrosect just before procalming a person to be mislead please do take look at what the possible of beeing him right .and other signs fall ofcouse with- in the perimeter of Islaam.

    May Allah SWT help us to understand his Deen. Ameen.

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  58. Abd- Allah

    Brother MA,
    first of all, NO ONE except Allah knows who are the Awliya of Allah. So, If from that hadith you understand that it is permissible to invent new ways to worship Allah and get closer to Him by means that His prophet peace be upon him and his companions never used to do, and that you can call upon other people besides Allah and make du’a asking them for things, and that you can go to graves and do acts of worship there, and that you can narrate fabricated hadiths and attribites lies to the prophet peace be upon him, and that if a sheikh is a “wali” of Allah then he does not need to pray anymore, then you have a problem in understanding what islam is all about.

    It is unfortunate that Muslims go to extremes in their own religion when Allah tells the people of the book in the Quran that they should not go to extremes in their religion and worship ‘Isa peace be upon him.

    Calling upon prophet Muhammad peace be upon him is a form of worship! As the prophet himself says in a sahih hadith: “du’a is worship”.
    Who gave the sufis a license to make du’a to the prophet and worship him in that way?

    If you have trouble with understanding these basic concepts in islam, then I will have to ask you to go read your Quran instead of taking what your sheikh says for granted.

    May Allah show us the truth as truth, and falsehood as falsehood.

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  59. MA

    Brother Abd-Allah

    If one is proclaming that its is ONLY Allah that know who are Awliya it again trying to take the job of Allah SWT. Isn;t is posible that Allah SWT has informed other people too who is who. On what basis you are saying this…

    ….Calling upon prophet Muhammad peace be upon him is a form of worship! As the prophet himself says in a sahih hadith: “du’a is worship”.Who gave the sufis a license to make du’a to the prophet and worship him in that way?..

    Are you inferring they are doing an idol worship ? Ofcouse they aren’t and they are taking the name of Muhammed SallahahuWaliwaSallam which is as you mentioned is a worhip . Well the license .. Allah SWT mentioned in Quraan..
    .…….” Wama KahalaTul Jinna Wal InSa iLLa liYaBudooon…” al Dhariyaat: 56 (aayah)
    Isn’t that enough?

    …” It is unfortunate that Muslims go to extremes in their own religion when Allah tells the people of the book in the Quran that they should not go to extremes in their religion and worship ‘Isa peace be upon him…”

    What is the status of Isa Peace Be Upon Him… HE is considered to be nauZubillah Son of God. Are you saying that these people are making Him (Muhammad Sallahu-alaihiWa Sallam) the sun of Allah. ..Ofcourse they aren’t.. So what are you trying to say by quoting this Aayah.??

    May Allah SWT help us understand his religon.

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  60. MA

    Brother Abd-Allah

    If one is proclaming that its is ONLY Allah that know who are Awliya it again trying to take the job of Allah SWT. Isn;t is posible that Allah SWT has informed other people too who is who. On what basis you are saying this…

    ….Calling upon prophet Muhammad peace be upon him is a form of worship! As the prophet himself says in a sahih hadith: “du’a is worship”.Who gave the sufis a license to make du’a to the prophet and worship him in that way?..

    Are you inferring they are doing an idol worship ? Ofcouse they aren’t and they are taking the name of Muhammed SallahahuWaliwaSallam which is as you mentioned is a worhip . Well the license .. Allah SWT mentioned in Quraan..
    .…….” Wama KahalaTul Jinna Wal InSa iLLa liYaBudooon…” al Dhariyaat: 56 (aayah)
    Isn’t that enough?

    …” It is unfortunate that Muslims go to extremes in their own religion when Allah tells the people of the book in the Quran that they should not go to extremes in their religion and worship ‘Isa peace be upon him…”

    What is the status of Isa Peace Be Upon Him… HE is considered to be nauZubillah Son of God. Are you saying that these people are making Him (Muhammad Sallahu-alaihiWa Sallam) the son of Allah SWT. ..Ofcourse they aren’t.. So what are you trying to say by quoting this Aayah.??

    May Allah SWT help us understand his religon.

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  61. Abd- Allah

    Akhi MA,
    the verse you quoted that Allah only created us to worship Him is an argument against those who make du’a asking things from prophets or righteous people instead of asking Allah. Since du’a is a form of worship, then making du’a to anyone besides Allah and asking him for something is not allowed. If the claim here is that these people are worshipping Allah, then my question is why don’t they make du’a to Allah and ask Him instead of asking others besides Him??

    Anyone who makes du’a to prophet Muhammad peace be upon him and asks him for something is worshipping him, and so YES, this is like idol worship.

    May Allah show us the truth as truth, and falsehood as falsehood

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  62. Just wondering

    Has anyone ever seen that movie “The Neverending Story”?

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  63. Ali B

    THere’s something beautiful in our deen called IKHTILAAF – Difference of Opinion amongst the scholars.

    So respect the difference – if you don’t agree it’s ok…we all don’t have to agree.

    Simple.

    and…Love the Prophet Sal Allahu alaihi wa salam :-) Love does wonders.

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  64. Abd- Allah

    Brother Ali B,

    No Mawlid is not permissible, and it will never be. Sorry, this is something all the sufis will have to accept.

    and NO, ikhtilaf is NOT beautiful at all! I don’t know what kind of ideas you have from your sufi sheikh, but go back and read the Quran and you will see many verses where Allah talks about differing and not being united as being bad.

    Yes, all muslims should agree and unite upon the authentic Sunnah of our prophet peace be upon him.

    You say love the prophet. I agree, but you can ONLY love the prophet if you follow his guidance and not make up your own.

    Btw, that website should be “sufi path” instead of “sunni path”, because there is nothing about it that is sunni.

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  65. MA

    Brother AbdAllah –

    Before passing the judgement ya Akhi…why haven’t you even consider the very first hadith….
    Narated By ‘Umar bin Al-Khattab:
    I heard Allah’s Apostle saying, “The reward of deeds depends upon the intentions and every person will get the reward according to what he has intended. So whoever emigrated for worldly benefits or for a woman to marry, his emigration was for what he emigrated for.”

    For any action the intentions are the key..irrespective of a person is praying – 5 times and doing hajj… doesn’t matter if his intention is not for Allah SubhanaWaTaala. Though we born to our Mother but we believe it Allah SWT who made us come to this earth and don’t consider mother as a creator…. You can’t just take a literal meaning or context and apply a ruling .

    Having said that…

    If performing tawassul had been blasphemy, then the believers, i.e., the Prophet, sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam, his Companions, and the Salaf and Khalaf of this nation would not have done it. Yet it is mentioned in the sahih hadith of the Prophet that the Prophet used to ask Allah by saying: “O Allah, I ask You by the status of those who ask You “ Ibn Majah, Ibn Hajar, deemed it a strong hadith

    There is a hadith classified as sahih, that a blind man asked the Prophet, sallallahu ‘alayhi wa sallam, to make a supplication (du’a’) to Allah to return his sight. The Prophet ordered him to make ablution (wudu’) and pray two rak’ahs and then say:
    “O Allah, I ask You and direct myself to You by Your Prophet, Muhammad, the Prophet of Mercy. O Muhammad, I ask Allah SWT by you to fulfill my need. O Allah, enable him to intercede for me.” The blind man did what the Prophet taught him to do and Allah SWT brought his sight back. Moreover, as related by at-Tabarani, the tawassul made by the blind man was used by the Companions and Salaf after the
    death of the Prophet. Sixteen hafidhs of hadith classified this hadith as sahih, including at-Tirmidhi, at-Tabarani, al-Bayhaqi, as-
    Subki, among others.

    May Allah SWT help us understand HIS deen they HE SWT want us to understand. Ameen.

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  66. Abd- Allah

    Well in that case brother MA, please tell me then why did the companions at the time of Umar bin Alkhattab’s khilafa when there was a drought, why then did the companions go to Al-Abbas, the uncle of the prophet peace be upon him, and asked him to make du’a so that Allah would bring rain?! Why didn’t the companions then go to the prophet’s grave instead and made du’a asking the prophet???

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  67. MA

    Br. Abd-Allah ‘Umar Ibn al-Khattab performed the tawassul by al-‘Abbas (the uncle of the Prophet), may Allah reward their deeds, when he prayed the Salah of ‘Istisqa’ with the people. Salah of ‘Istisqa’ refers to performing a specific prayer which includes making supplication for rain.

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  68. Abd- Allah

    Brother MA, this still does not address why the companions went to the prophet’s uncle instead of just making du’a to the prophet himself after he had passed away.

    Now, the hadith of the blind man that you mention, even though it is true and has a good chain, but it does not provide proof for what the sufis are doing.

    First of all, the blind man went to the prophet peace be upon him to ask him to make du’a to Allah for him to be cured, because he knew that the prophet’s du’a is more likely to be accepted. Where as if the blind man’s intention was to seek nearness to Allah by means of the prophet’s person or status or his right, then he would have had no need to go to the prophet, but instead he would have just sat at home and made du’a saying “O Allah, I ask you by the status of Your prophet and his station with you to cure me and enable me to see.”
    However, the blind man did not do that, why? because he knew exactly what the Arabic word tawassul means, and he knew that it is not a word said by a person with a need, mentioning the name of a person as an intermediary, but rather it had to include coming to the one whom he believed to be pious and ask him to make du’a for him. So even though the man made du’a for himself, but the prophet also made du’a for him.

    You can’t take this story and twist it the way you want to make it evidence for all the shirk that some sufis do.

    I suggest you read the following book, even if your sheikh had already brain washed you that this book is not good. You will benefit a lot from it insha’Allah:
    Tawassul – Its Types & Its Rulings
    Shaykh Muhammad Naasirud-Deen al-Albaanee

    You can click on my name and download it for FREE.

    Read that book, you owe it to yourself.

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  69. Abd- Allah

    BTW brother MA, this hadith is WEAK and not strong:

    “the Prophet that the Prophet used to ask Allah by saying: “O Allah, I ask You by the status of those who ask You “”

    this is a WEAK hadith, so you can’t use it as proof for anything.

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  70. Abdullah

    Br Abd-Allah, how do you know its a weak hadith?

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  71. Abd- Allah

    Brother Abdullah,
    I know it is weak because several scholars have said so, like Almunziri, Ibn Taymiyah, and Albani, among others.

    Now, if you are asking how do I personally know that it is weak, well i know by looking at the chain of narrators of this hadith, and some of the people in that chain are known to the scholars to be weak narrators so their narrations aren’t accepted.

    Now, even if we were to say that this hadith is authentic and not weak, it would still not be proof that you can call upon people like that.

    BTW, the brother before provided an incorrect translation of the hadith, and he used this one:
    “O Allah, I ask You by the status of those who ask You “

    while in reality, the actual hadith in Arabic says:
    “O Allah, I ask You by the RIGHT of those who ask You”

    so the mistranslation of “right” into “status” is wrong.

    and we all know that the “right” of people who ask is for Allah to answer their du’a, and answering the du’a is one of the attributes of Allah, so even if that hadith was true hypothetically speaking, then this is evidence that you can do Tawassul to Allah by one of His attributes, which is the attribute of answering the du’a, and that is something permissible.

    So in reality, this weak hadith that the brother has mistranslated in an effort to use it as evidence to do tawassul sufi style which is not permissible, is in reality an evidence against sufis and what they do.

    for those who want to know more about Tawassul and its ruling in islam and what is permissible and what is not, then i sggest you read the book:
    Tawassul – Its Types & Its Rulings
    Shaykh Muhammad Naasirud-Deen al-Albaanee

    You can click on my name and download it for FREE. It is very beneficial and informative, and it talks about why certain hadiths are weak and points out the problem in them in details.

    Allah knows best.

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  72. Abdullah

    “I know it is weak because several scholars have said so, like Almunziri, Ibn Taymiyah, and Albani, among others.

    Now, if you are asking how do I personally know that it is weak, well i know by looking at the chain of narrators of this hadith, and some of the people in that chain are known to the scholars to be weak narrators so their narrations aren’t accepted.”

    So, basically you have no knowledge of your own with regards to whether this hadith is weak but are basing your opinion on the opinions of these scholars. Would it be safe to say that you are blindly following their opinions because you trust these scholars and their expertise in this field?

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  73. Abd- Allah

    NO akhi, like I said, from looking at the chain of narrators of this hadith closely, you can see the weakness in it because some of the narrators in it are weak. That is why I said go read that book, it has the details in it. Of course I look at what the scholars say about the hadith, but they also provide the chain of narration, and so by examining their proof and looking into details of the chain and the people in it, you can tell that it is weak. So even if i follow the scholars, but i do not follow them blindly. We are supposed to examine what the scholars say, and that which is true and in accordance to the Quran and the authentic sunnah, then we accept, and that which is not then we reject.

    As Imam Malik said: “Take and leave the words of all men, except the one in this grave,” pointing towards the grave of Allah’s Messenger (sallalalhu alaihi wa-sallam).

    So yes we honor our great scholars for what they have done for us and for islam, but we take and leave from what they say because they all make mistakes.

    So to answer your question akhi : “Would it be safe to say that you are blindly following their opinions because you trust these scholars and their expertise in this field?”

    No, I do not follow anyone blindly, even if they are experts in that field, but I still examine their evidence.

    Allah knows best.

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  74. Ali B

    Br. Abd-Allah,

    This deen is VAST.

    Shaykh Abdullah bin Baiyyah, who is a shaykh of shaykhs, has told us of the differences of opinion in Islam regarding issues amongst the scholars.

    Imam Abu Hanifa differed from Imam Shafi…does that meaan he was wrong?

    Even Salafi scholars differ in their opinion on Islamic issues.

    It’s very simple – have adab, have respect for the scholars, and be a uniter…unite the Muslims and don’t be a divider.

    Imam Suhaib Webb said it best when he said, “Be an Inviter, Don’t be an Indicter”

    May Allah help me to practice on this advice for I’m in need of it the most.

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  75. Abd- Allah

    Brother Ali B,
    valid differences of opinion are one thing, even the companions differed on minor things sometimes, but this is no difference of opinion. This is an obvious bid’a and nothing but evil. How can someone claim to love the prophet peace be upon him while not follow his guidance?!

    When 2 scholars differ, in some cases, yes one of them is wrong and the other is right. However, the one who is wrong still gets one reward for the ruling that he arrived at if he used the correct methodology.

    The issue here is not about differing, it is about an innovation, a major one that wasn’t even at the time of the prophet not his companions.

    And you are saying lets unite. Unite on what i ask? There can only be unity between the muslims when they all unite on the truth, which is the Quran, the authentic sunnah, and what the companions were upon. You can never unite people on falsehood, and this idea where muslims unite while ignoring their major differences in the way they practice and understand islam, is a false basis and it will never happen.

    I don’t care on what shuyukh said what, and you are trying to use what they say to justify that we should accept all the differences between us and not call anyone else wrong when they are wrong and stay quiet about them. The Quran and the prophet say otherwise.

    When you want to come back to the true sunnah of the prophet and practice and understand islam the way the comapnions used to, then come and say unite and we can unite on the truth.

    and I do have respect for the scholars, but not everyone who calls himself a scholar is one. I do not consider any of the sufi shuyukh to be a scholar, because no one from Ahlul sunnah wal jama’a considers them to be so.

    My last piece of advice is that “sunni path” should change its name to “sufi path”, as it is a more befitting name for it.

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  76. MA

    Assalam-alaikum

    Br.Abd-Allah –

    “O Allah, I ask You and direct myself to You by Your Prophet, Muhammad, the Prophet of Mercy. O Muhammad, I ask Allah SWT by you to fulfill my need. O Allah, enable him to intercede for me.” The blind man did what the Prophet taught him to do and Allah SWT brought his sight back. Moreover, as related by at-Tabarani, the tawassul made by the blind man was used by the Companions and Salaf after the
    death of the Prophet.
    Sixteen hafidhs of hadith classified this hadith as sahih, including at-Tirmidhi, at-Tabarani, al-Bayhaqi, as-Subki, among others.

    Let’s not get into the details of the hadiths classfication. And you do agree the WEAK is NOT a WRONG Hadith. And you agree with the Iman Shafai views and ruling as you mentioned him. His (Imam Shafai) take is “HE RATHER TAKE A WEAK HADITH THAN INVENT HIS OWN VIEW OR DECISION” So just don’t give the perception that this hadith is Wrong by saying its Weak. Its has its own status.
    Yes a weak hadith can’t be used in legal matter as proof which isnt the context ..

    (2)- Do you have the Arabic Wording of this hadith? There is something called a contextual meaning of the words than a dictionary one. This same hadith has been take as Sahih by at-Tirmidhi, at-Tabarani, al-Bayhaqi, as-Subki, among others (16 Scholars). Whose translation are you looking –t a dictionary meaning or “A” scholar representation?.

    (3)- You wrote …
    ….Well in that case brother MA, please tell me then why did the companions at the time of Umar bin Alkhattab’s khilafa when there was a drought, why then did the companions go to Al-Abbas, the uncle of the prophet peace be upon him, and asked him to make du’a so that Allah would bring rain?! …

    The question would answer itself if you had asked ” Why did Umar bin Alkhattab’ RadilalahTala Anhu had to even go to al-’Abbas (the uncle of the Prophet), may Allah reward their deeds” while Umar RadilalahTala Anhu himself had prayed to the Allah SWT. So you of the view that Umar RadilalahTala Anhu did a mistake by going to al-’Abbas rather just directly to Allah SWT?

    May Allah SWT guide us all… Ameen

    Allah know best……

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  77. Ibn Mikdad

    “Let’s not get into the details of the hadiths classfication. And you do agree the WEAK is NOT a WRONG Hadith. And you agree with the Iman Shafai views and ruling as you mentioned him. His (Imam Shafai) take is “HE RATHER TAKE A WEAK HADITH THAN INVENT HIS OWN VIEW OR DECISION” So just don’t give the perception that this hadith is Wrong by saying its Weak. Its has its own status.”

    The issue of tawassul is an issue of creed; how can Asharis accept weak hadiths to support their misguided opinions, while rejecting authentic ahad ahadith which nullify their innovated opinions related to the issue of Divine attributes? My opinion is that they don’t, and that MA has no idea what he’s talking about (the above quote is obviously related to fiqh, not aqidah), just repeating his nonsense hoping that application of Goebbels’s principle of turning a lie into a “truth” through repetition will start giving results. Alhamdulillah, brother Abd-Allah has obviously understood this and is keen not to allow the innovators to have the last word.

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  78. Abd- Allah

    Brother MA,
    from your reply, it seems that you didn’t even bother read what i had wrote earlier.
    I never said that the hadith of the blind man was weak, it is true, as i had said before, however, what i said is that it is not proof that can be used to do tawassul the way sufis do it by asking the prophet himself. This type of tawassul, where the blind man went and asked the prophet to make du’a for him that Allah cures him, is the type of tawassul that is permissible, and this is what Umar bin alkhattab did when he went to Al-’Abbas the uncle of the Prophet and asked him to make du’a for them to get rain. So asking a righteous living person to make du’a for you is the type of tawassul that is permissible.

    As for the other hadith which is weak (and yes, weak means wrong btw, and no one said you have to make your own opinion about something if there is only a weak hadith available on the issue, like this one for example), so this hadith is weak which you mentioned as the du’a of the prophet saying “O Allah, I ask You by the right of those who ask You…”, this hadith is the weak one, and even if it was not weak, it would be evidence against what sufis do, not for them.

    and yes, if the hadith is weak that means it is not true. We don’t build our islam on weak hadiths.

    as for the translation of that weak hadith that you provided, yes I have the Arabic narration, and it does not have the word “status” in it what so ever, not even anything close, so this is a clear mistranslation.

    Akhi, what is your point here? what are you trying to prove? lets get to the point because i am really tired of this pointless arguing.

    Again, if you really are sincere about knowing which types of tawassul are authentic and allowed in islam, then you would do yourself a favor and download that free book and read it. If you don’t read that book, it means you are brainwashed and blindly follow what your sufi sheikh tells you, and you will never know the truth if you stay in your little shell.

    Akhi, if you are sincere about finding out the truth, then do read that book. After all, this does involves the basics of islam, which is Tawheed, and calling upon dead people to help you out is a form of shirk, so watch out akhi.

    May Allah show us truth as truth and falsehood as false.

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  79. MA

    Brother Abd-Allah

    And where did you get this Weak hadith is Wrong Hadith- as per which hadith nomenclature? And Akhi this delluded acceptance of Tawassul/Tawaasul when there isn’t way around ….while potraying perception that Tasaawuf is wrong. Sufis are wrong. and passing a blatent judgement on anybody based on once own mis-interpretation…. And Ya Akhi Islaam has a 14 hundred years of History it just didn’t come in 12th Century as you are just quoting A book by Shaikh Albanee…just look beyond before getting to a decision – consider a potential of once own decision been a brain washed one . One didn’t even bother to consider

    On the authority of Abu Huraira Radiallah Anhu who said the messenger of Allah Sallahu-alaihiWaSallam. ” Allah , the Exalted has said: Whosoever shows enimity to the friend of Mine, I shall be at war with him. My slave does not draw near to Me with anything more loved by Me than the religious duties I have imposed upon him, and My slave continues to draw near to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. When I love him <p. I am his hearing with which he hears , his seeing with which he see, his hand with which he holds and his foot with which he walks. Were he to as something of Me I would surely give it to him and were he to as Me for refuge I would surely grant him it al-Bukhari

    While branding the Shuyuks (as you have mentioned above) as blaming them of wrong doing ..shrik etc?

    Well trying to be a unique and distinct is good lets remind ourself of Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) has said…

    (1) The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “The Shaitaan continually pursues humans as a wolf
    pursues sheep. The wolf only dares to attack those sheep, which have separated from the rest of the flock and are standing alone. And
    so, my followers and my devotees! Save yourselves from being caught in the traps of misguidance and firmly remain with the largest and
    most well known group of Muslims!” ( Imam Ahmed)

    (2)The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “Allah will never allow my Ummah to unite upon misguidance and incorrect beliefs. Allah’s mercy, blessings and protection are with the largest group of Muslims. And he who deviates
    from this largest group of Muslims will be thrown into Hell.”(Tirmizi)

    (3)The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “He who deviates from the largest group of Muslims, even as much as a hand span, has himself cut off his connection with Islam.” (Abu Daud, Imam Ahmed)

    Jazakallah..

    May Allah SWT help us in understanding HIS deen the way HE want as to Undersand.. Ameen.

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  80. MA

    Brother Abd-Allah

    And where did you get this Weak hadith is Wrong Hadith- as per which hadith nomenclature? And Akhi this delluded acceptance of Tawassul/Tawaasul when there isn’t way around ….while potraying perception that Tasaawuf is wrong. Sufis are wrong. and passing a blatent judgement on anybody based on once own mis-interpretation…. And Ya Akhi Islaam has a 14 hundred years of History it just didn’t come in 12th Century as you are just quoting A book by Shaikh Albanee…just look beyond before getting to a decision – consider a potential of once own decision been a brain washed one . One didn’t even bother to consider

    On the authority of Abu Huraira Radiallah Anhu who said the messenger of Allah Sallahu-alaihiWaSallam. ” Allah , the Exalted has said: Whosoever shows enimity to the friend of Mine, I shall be at war with him. My slave does not draw near to Me with anything more loved by Me than the religious duties I have imposed upon him, and My slave continues to draw near to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. When I love him <p. I am his hearing with which he hears , his seeing with which he see, his hand with which he holds and his foot with which he walks. Were he to as something of Me I would surely give it to him and were he to as Me for refuge I would surely grant him it al-Bukhari

    While branding the Shuyuks (as you have mentioned above) as blaming them of wrong doing ..shrik etc?

    Well trying to be a unique and distinct is good lets remind ourself of Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) has said…

    (1) The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “The Shaitaan continually pursues humans as a wolf
    pursues sheep. The wolf only dares to attack those sheep, which have separated from the rest of the flock and are standing alone. And
    so, my followers and my devotees! Save yourselves from being caught in the traps of misguidance and firmly remain with the largest and
    most well known group of Muslims!” ( Imam Ahmed)

    (2)The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “Allah will never allow my Ummah to unite upon misguidance and incorrect beliefs. Allah’s mercy, blessings and protection are with the largest group of Muslims. And he who deviates
    from this largest group of Muslims will be thrown into Hell.”(Tirmizi)

    (3)The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) said: “He who deviates from the largest group of Muslims, even as much as a hand span, has himself cut off his connection with Islam.” (Abu Daud, Imam Ahmed)

    Jazakallah..

    May Allah SWT help us in understanding HIS deen the way HE want as to Understand.. Ameen.

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  81. Abd- Allah

    Akhi, it is the sufis that have deviated from the group of muslims, and you can ask any sheikh who is not sufi, and he will tell you that what sufis are doing are wrong.

    You have not even examined the other side or seen what they have to say, where as I have seen what sufis do, and nothing of the innovations that they do are supported by our prophet’s sunnah.

    Naqshbend, the founder of the Nakshbendi sufi order, said the following: “I have disbelieved in the religion of Allah, and disbeleiving is obligatory.” (Almawahib Assarmadiyyah, p: 162)

    Alkaramani Alyamani, one of the sufi sheikhs, said: “when we say the creation, we mean the creator, and when we say the rock, we mean Allah.” (Masra’ Attasawwuf, p: 196)

    Now you want to tell me that what the sufis are doing is correct?! that they are practicing true islam?! If some sufis are following Naqshbend who said that he disbelieves in the religion of Allah, then do you think they are on the straight path?! To see what the sufis do and say, and continue to be a sufi, it means you are either stubborn or ignorant.

    I don’t think this discussion is going any where, so it would be better to leave it here and stop talking about it.

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  82. Ibn Mikdad

    “And Ya Akhi Islaam has a 14 hundred years of History…”

    And this is something innovators fear the most, because their dogmatic history does not start with the Prophet, saws, nor with the Sahaba, r.a., nor with the successors, nor with the scholar who followed them. As shaykh Yasir Qadhi explained in his recent lecture posted on MM, Asharis were a minority sect for the greater part of the early Muslim history, which is why they rarely quote any of the Salaf to support their misguided beliefs, and when they do, they misinterpret them or use narrations of dubious authenticity…

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  83. Abd- Allah

    What I don’t get is the Asharis that follow a Madhab, and they take all their fiqh and rulings from one of those 4 imams, but when it comes to aqeedah and creed, they oppose all these 4 imams and hang on to the Ashari aqeedah. Where is the sense in that?!

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  84. Ibn Mikdad

    We could and should go even further; they (claim to) follow the Prophet s.a.w.s., and the Sahaba, s.a.w.s., but oppose the Prophet s.a.w.s. and all the Sahaba in matters related to creed and hang on to Ashari Aqeedah. That is their greatest contradiction and affront against the religion. They also forget that Imam Ahmad forbade people from visiting the proto-kalamist Ibn Kullab, and Ibn Kullab’s innovations compared to modern-day Ashari aqeedah are almost unworthy of being mentioned. And they also forget the fact that there was a time when Ashari aqeedah did not exist; there was only Ahlu-Sunnah and the innovated sects; so when Abul-Hasan al Ashari repented from Mu’tazilisim, had he really wanted to follow the Sunni creed, all he had to do is join the existing Sunni camp and follow their teachings. But he didn’t, and this is the most obvious evidence that Asharism is not a Sunni creed.

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  85. Abdullah

    “I do not consider any of the sufi shuyukh to be a scholar, because no one from Ahlul sunnah wal jama’a considers them to be so.”

    Of course not because after all, you are the spokesperson of Ahlus Sunnah wal jama’a, right? Pray tell, do you consider yourself a scholar that you think you have the right to lay judgment like that. I don’t want to argue with you because it will lead to nowhere but I just wanted to point out the incredible ignorance in your statement. Every post of yours makes it clearer that you have absolutely no understanding of Tasawwuf or any of its depth and are just speaking from the hip or just parroting what you heard from someone else. The greatest scholars in our history studied and practiced Tasawwuf, including but not limited to Imam Hasan Al-Basri, Imam Abu Hamid Al-Ghazali, Imam Nawawi, Shaykh Abdul Qadir Jilani, Maulana Jalaluddin Rumi, and Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi. But oh wait, they’re not even scholars because they were sufi, right? I’m sure they are all innovators in your book. Ma’adh Allah…seriousley.

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  86. Abu Abdul

    @Abdullah,
    Can u mention just one quotation from Hassan Al Basri where he mentioned the word, “tasawwuf/sufism”?

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  87. Abdullah

    No need and irrelevent. His actions spoke louder than words. If you want a quote, lets look at what an individual who you AND I DO consider a scholar said. Imam ibn Taymiyyah says, “Tasawwuf’s place of origin is Basra” in reference to Imam Hasan Al-Basri and his students fame as Sufis. What is your response to that?

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  88. Ibn Mikdad

    “No need and irrelevent. His actions spoke louder than words. If you want a quote, lets look at what an individual who you AND I DO consider a scholar said. Imam ibn Taymiyyah says, “Tasawwuf’s place of origin is Basra” in reference to Imam Hasan Al-Basri and his students fame as Sufis. What is your response to that?”

    And your proof that he was implying Hasan al Basri by this is exactly what? Mu’tazilizm’s place of origin is also Basra; if I say that, am I implying that Hasan al Basri was behind it? And by the way, Hasan al Basri was well know for criticism of certain practices typical of the sufis; off the top of my head, I can remember a narration i which he criticized a person who voluntarily forbade himself a certain type of food (obviously trying to be ultra-abstinent, a typical sufi exaggeration). The fact that Hasan al Basri was a zahid in no way means that he practiced innovations and heretical beliefs prevalent among the sufis; combine that with the afct that he never ascribed himself to sufism in name, and your argument crumbles in it’s entirety…

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  89. Abdullah

    Innovations and heretical beliefs practiced by people claiming to be sufis does not take away from my initial point that the greatest scholars in our history practiced Tasawwuf. From all the scholars that I listed, you could only come up with a response with regards to Imam Hasan Al-Basri regarding whethere he said the word “Sufism” or “Tasawwuf”. Any legit scholar of Tasawwuf will tell you that Tasawwuf is the practice of seeking nearness to Allah through following the Shariah and the Sunnah of the Prophet (s). Do you know what Tazkiyya? Do you think that the science of trying to purifying your heart is just something random? Its the same thing. Imam Malik (r) says that “He who practices Tasawwuf without learning Sacred Law corrupts his faith, while he who learns Sacred Law without practicing Tasawwuf corrupts himself. Only he who combines the two proves true.” Do you disagree with this statement? I will wholeheartedly agree with you that there ARE folks out there claiming to be sufis that engage in severe innovations and do things which are not sanctioned by the Shariah or the Sunnah. Based on Imam Maliks statement, thats not even Tasawwuf…its something else. Allahu’alam…I really wish people knew what real Tasawwuf was but people will stick to their biases and their boxes and act like theyre being open minded. Khair…I’m done here. Salam!

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  90. Ibn Mikdad

    “Do you know what Tazkiyya? Do you think that the science of trying to purifying your heart is just something random? Its the same thing.”

    Well why don’t you just call it tazkiyah when it’s the same thing? No one has a problem with tazkiyah, it is a concept that has it’s roots deep in the Revealed Texts, both in essence and etymology; no scholar sticking to the Sunnah denies that; they even emphasize it as a correct way of purifying ones heart as opposed to sufism. The reason why you stick to sufism instead of tazkiyah is probably the fact that sufism is not only about tazkiyah as it is described in the Kitab and Sunnah, but contains much more, both in beliefs and pracices, that opposes that which was revealed. Tazkiyah by the way of Sunnah is simply not enough for you.

    “Its the same thing. Imam Malik (r) says that “He who practices Tasawwuf without learning Sacred Law corrupts his faith, while he who learns Sacred Law without practicing Tasawwuf corrupts himself. Only he who combines the two proves true.” Do you disagree with this statement?”

    I will agree and disagree with that statement when I get to know it’s source, because I’m not unused to seeing sufis use texts of dubious authenticity to support their dubious beliefs. While we’re at it, since you want to stick to what Imam Malik said (if he said it) so rigidly, why don’t you accept the authentic narration from him in which he decrees that it is obligatory to believe that istawa over the Arsh happened in reality (without saying how)? Let me guess, you won’t follow him in this particular case, will you? Why? Because, like in most other cases, your “shuyookh” don’t like it. And this is to what it all boils down, regarding sufism, tawassul, aqeedah, etc.; you believe what they tell you to believe, never mind the evidence.
    As far as Imam Malik’s attitude towards sufism is concerned, I will reproduce a text of one of MM post which dealt with precisely that:

    Quotes & Stories: The Day Imam Malik Laughed…

    “We were with Malik while he was surrounded by his companions, when a man belonging to the people of Nasibin said, ‘There is a group of people among us called Sufis. They eat excessively, then they begin to sing, and then they get up and dance.’ Malik asked him, ‘Are they children?’ The man replied, ‘No.’ Malik asked, ‘Are they insane?’ The man replied, ‘No. They are a group of mashayikh [religious scholars] and other intelligent people.’ Malik replied, ‘I have never heard of anyone from the people of Islam doing such a thing.’

    The man said, ‘But these people eat, and then get up and dance tirelessly, some of them striking their heads, and some striking their faces.’ Hearing this, Malik laughed, then rose and went inside his house. The companions of Malik said to the man, ‘Verily you have brought bad omen to our companion. We have been in his company for more than thirty years, and we never saw him laugh until this day.’”
    [Qadi `Iyad, Tartib al-Madarik, 2:54]

    Enough said…

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  91. Abd- Allah

    Brother Abdullah,
    It is interesting that you mention Imam Abu Hamid Al-Ghazali, because the scholars of hadith say that his book Al’ihya’ is the biggest collection of fabricated ahadiths and lies attributed to the prophet peace be upon him. Some scholar if he has attributed more lies to the prophet than any other person. Of course if Al-Ghazali is the sheikh you try to follow, no wonder you think that Mawlid and other innovations are good.

    One more thing. You can quote the previous scholars all you want about tasawwuf, but the truth is that tasawwuf has evolved and changed A LOT from back then, when it ONLY meant Zuhd and not caring too much about this world, while today the word tasawwuf means a bunch of innovators dancing and singing songs that have shirk in them.

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  92. Abd- Allah

    “where did you get this Weak hadith is Wrong Hadith”

    Brother MA,
    if you know basic Arabic, you would know that a “sahih” hadith means a true hadith (sahih literally means true), and if the opposite of sahih (true) is da’ef or weak, then does that make the weak hadith true as well?! If sahih and weak are opposites, then how can they both be true, and why should we even bother classifying the hadiths and studying their chains if we are going to use them all regardless of how weak they are?!

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  93. Qas

    Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal also prohibited the people from learning from Alharith AlMuhasibi

    Man…sometimes I wonder what Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal would say about us if he was alive today…

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  94. Abd- Allah

    Brother Qas,

    if you are one of the muslims who tries his best to follow the sunnah and stay away from the haram as much as you can, and if you don’t have any innovations or shirk, then Imam Ahmad wouldn’t say anything about you. However, if you are an innovator who starts new matters in our religion and do not follow the sunnah but instead misguide the people by the innovations that you introduce and call people to your falsehood, then he will not be quiet about you and will expose the falsehood and innovations so that the general muslim people aren’t fooled by you and follow the innovations that you are calling others to follow.

    May Allah have mercy on Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal, he was a true follower and defender of the sunnah and he put innovations out as soon as they started.

    Allah knows best.

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