You walk into the masjid for salah, and you see a group of about 15 people who you don't normally see. They are influential people in the community, they live in the community, but why all of a sudden are they all here to pray Maghrib in jama'ah? Coincidence? In most communities, it's a sign that the masjid board is about to meet.

This in and of itself should be a telltale sign of where our communities stand. Unfortunately, many times the people who are running it are not knowledgable of Islam, and are not even actually involved in attending the masajid regularly. The obvious result of this is a lot of fighting, bickering, arguing, and in the end the splitting of the masjid into two.

Why is it that the masjid board members can't learn to disagree in a polite manner? What hope is there for the community when its leaders are leading the parade of name-calling, false accusations, and dirty politics? Is there a solution for this?

The answer is yes, and its actually simple. Well simple and extremely difficult at the same time. Ideally the masjid would be led by people who have a deep understanding of the Sunnah, and the etiquettes it teaches for dealing with people. Ideally there would be an imam at the masjid who is involved in the decision making process giving his input, and setting a standard for people to aspire for and emulate. The simple part is to say an imam or board members like this is the solution. The hard part is getting them there in those positions. The hard part is for another time and place. For now, I want to give a story of how such an imam can be a calming force in the time of fitnah.

I generally avoid attending board meetings, or getting involved, much less remembering what took place in them (I try to forget soon afterwards). This is partly because since childhood I have seen more board meetings than most people care to mention. I have attended masjid construction meetings with my father from the initial meeting all the way through completion (and this is before I was even in high school). I have yelled, been yelled at, and broken up physical confrontations. For my many stories of masjid conflict, there is only one story of conflict resolution.

The story affected me in such a way that I can still replay the entire sequence of events in my head as if I am watching a video recording of it.

In the days after the tragedy of 9/11, the hubbub at the masjid was reaching peak levels of what to do, and how to respond. Somehow or another, I got roped in to a meeting about what the masjid should do. The meeting after Isha had about 15-20 people. They sat down and discussed what the masjid should do in response. Should we take out an ad in the community paper? Should we have an open house? The usual suggestions came up. Somehow, the meeting degenerated (surprise) into a back and forth of 10 year old issues that had been bubbling under the surface about how the masjid has been run, certain activities, etc.

Shortly thereafter the yelling ensued, to the extent that one brother began physically shaking as he spoke angrily.

Then the imam stepped in. A soft spoken imam, masha'Allah, one that you can see in his manners that he is trying to follow the Sunnah. Soft spoken – but assertive in the proper way. He immediately halted the meeting and made everyone stop speaking. Then he went around the entire meeting one by one, beginning with himself, and said everyone needs to say audhu billahi min ash-shaytaani rajeem. So we went around the room with everyone saying that. All of a sudden you see everyone start taking deep breaths and calming themselves. Then he gave a quick advice about anger and how to talk with one another – and when I say short I mean less than 60 seconds, but to the point.

The meeting focused back on the issue at hand, and finally some decisions were made. You would think the meeting would be over now, but the imam took it to the next step. Before letting us depart he said, there is one condition on everyone before they leave this meeting. You must now say salam and hug every single person in this meeting before you leave. SubhanAllah, I cannot describe the effect that it had on everyone. Initially the gut reaction of some was, what is this guy talking about? But once everyone did it, all of a sudden everyone was laughing and friends again.

Differences, but settled. Arguments, but resolved. Politics, name-calling, and fallout – none.

May Allah (swt) unite all of our communities and grant us success.

35 Responses

  1. ruth nasrullah

    Asalaamu alaikum.

    As an American-born convert who just started attending a masjid in the past three years I’m horrified by the way so many masjid administrators and congregation members behave.

    It’s not how churches conduct business.

    Or synagogues.

    Or the PTA.

    Or hospital boards.

    Or executive boards.

    Who among those groups has a higher purpose and a higher standard of behavior to live up to?

    I once heard a sheikh suggest that part of the problem is that people who come from countries where there is no true democracy aren’t as readily able to govern democratically as those who do. Do you think there’s truth in that? Or maybe there just aren’t enough women on boards. Maybe less testosterone would help.

    This is a subject near to my heart because although I’ve been very involved in masjid activities, in the last few months I’ve withdrawn from most of them because I simply cannot stand the fighting, screaming, yelling, fist-waving, crying, etc. Those people don’t represent the religion I embraced.

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  2. AbdulRahman

    Ma sha’ Allah, brilliant approach. Thanks for the lesson!

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  3. ibnabeeomar

    sister ruth you have reached the same conclusion that i and many people i know have also reached. there’s simply too many obstacles to overcome with people like that, that its practically impossible for 1-2 people to make a difference in that capacity.

    i hope that doesn’t sound like a defeatist attitude, because i think there’s other ways of affecting positive change, i just don’t think the board is one of them precisely because of the prevalence of whats been mentioned.

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    • Maher-ATL

      AA Brother Omar, excellent and simple lesson in conflict resolution. J.A.Kh.
      As far as the discussion about Governing Boards, the biggest issue in Islamic (and other faith) institutions is mixing up governing with operations. Board of Trustees should be focused on the general direction of the institution, long range goals, and other strategic matters. For the daily operation needs there should be a different team with a different focus. Without separating these two groups there will always be problems. Second is accountability. The leader of the operations team (a director or Imam) can report to the governing Board, and more importantly will hold himself and the operations team accountable. The model can help organizations avoid much conflict.
      As far as the Islamic aspect of governance, it comes if the form of genuine and sincere commitment to the Shura decision making. Whether it is on the operations tem, executive committee or governing Board, making decisions should follow a thorough consultative process. One Board member or one team member should not speak for the team until consultation is completed and the team/board leader makes the decision based on the consultation. Debating different options should take place in a professional manner not in the hallways of the Masjid, but in proper meetings. Finally, transparency is the tool that will help protect this whole process and make it consistent.
      I share the sentiment that many Masajid may have issues and may not conduct business in an Islamic manner, but let us not generalize. I also see anumber of Islamic institutions that are recruiting experienced managers and corporate professionals to help, and give the pediatritions a break! :) The awakening has begun.

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  4. Bint Amina

    It is most difficult when the ‘ideal’ situation isn’t the case, but rather the former that you had mentioned is [when places of worship become affairs of dirty politics and when you wonder how the leaders received and are retaining their positions].

    Moreover, it becomes more complicated when participating in the meetings in order to bring about good becomes a frustrating reality if you cannot change what you set out to change. More complicated even still, in fact, if you attend the meetings (in which many comments made have the effect of shock and awe – given the setting) and you remain silent about them, perhaps this may be held against you, subhaanAllaah. If you have the resolve to do so however, may Allah reward you and give you strength in this; but for others it may serve to lower their emaan, and inshaaAllah if this is the case, perhaps they may bring about change by taking another avenue.

    In the end however, du’aa is your greatest instrument, for indeed, it is the weapon of the believer.

    And surely Allah ta’ala Knows Best.

    Wa Salamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatu

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  5. AnonyMouse

    Subhan’Allah.
    A beautiful story, that… ameen, thumma ameen to your du’aa!

    Well, I haven’t actually been witness to such meetings, but my dad has and I’ve listened to the post-meeting-conversations… few of which were pleasant.

    My personal approach is simply to say what YOU need to say, and then just listen to everyone else without reacting even if you really, really disagree with them. Debating and arguing rarely gets you anywhere. I tend to give little importance to words, and far more to action – so it’s not what was said in the meeting that counts, but was DONE afterwards. And sometimes, if nobody agrees with you, you just need to be able to do what little you can on your own, and that’s it.

    I think a good question to ask whenever one of us might be caught in such a situation is: “What would the Prophet (SAW) say about our actions if he was here right now?” and “Do I/you/we think that Allah approves of this?”

    May Allah strengthen us in our emaan, help us perfect our adaab and deal with other with the best of akhlaaaq, and unite our hearts, ameen!

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  6. ahmed

    Great article jazakum Allahu khairan.

    I also have seen lots and lots of board meetings, but alhamdulillah i’ve only been involved in very few of them.

    After seeing all of those things, I have no intention of being involved in board meetings or discussions again.

    It’s just not productive, and imagine how terrible the situation is when seeing the masjid and the community members ends up actually lowering one’s iman instead of raising it.

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  7. The Wahhabi Misanthrope

    The old guard should be kicked off masjid boards. They don’t bring anything valuable to them anyway. I know of a mosque where the board is full of young, pious brothers, and it doesn’t come across the above problems.

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  8. ahmed

    Oh yeah i wanted to mention:

    Sr Ruth:

    In certain cultures, that is exactly the way they conduct business: yelling, screaming, insulting each other, also insulting their mothers, and threatening physical harm. I had invested some money in a business which was 100% muslim owned, so I got to see all of that firsthand.

    It doesn’t help when, for those cultures at least, many end up in leadership positions in their chosen fields here too, like becoming doctors, running their own businesses, getting tenured professorships, etc. In such cases, they are waited on hand and foot by their underlings, and of course that affects their self perception.

    It also doesn’t help when our historical heroic leaders are always presented as micromanaging, dictatorial, temperamental and always having their whips ready on their shoulders. Usually people only remember the stories about toughess on the part of the leaders, and forget the softer stories.

    But it’s like they say: we get the leaders we deserve, and we get the leaders most similar to ourselves.

    wa Allahu ta’ala a’lam

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  9. AnonyMouse

    MW: I don’t think that the answer is to get rid of all the old guys – yeah, they do have their issues; but at the same time they have a lot of wisdom and experience.

    I think that the best thing would be to have a 50/50 split between the “elders” and the newbies… that way you have the benefit of both fresh blood and old brains! Of course, they’d have to work hard to get along and learn to understand each other, but I do think that in the end things could work out, insha’Allah.

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  10. The Wahhabi Misanthrope

    Mouse: Actually, believe it or not you’ll find more ‘maturity’ in our youth than in our elders, and certainly more knowledge.

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  11. AnonyMouse

    Nah… I really think that it depends on the people. Personally, I’ve found that there are many people of great knowledge and wisdom (and maturity) in people of all ages. Perhaps this is because the Islamic centre I was “raised” in was somewhat small, had no ethnic majority, and was a place where people of all ages got together to learn and to strengthen the bonds of Islamic brother/sisterhood.

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  12. nuqtah

    [quote]I once heard a sheikh suggest that part of the problem is that people who come from countries where there is no true democracy aren’t as readily able to govern democratically as those who do [/quote]

    Of course there may be cultural reasons behind how people behave or act. But, why is the solution always,” they need a lesson in (western) democracy?”

    I mean are these people inherently incapable of acting appropriately? And what did that ‘shaykh’ mean by ‘democracy’ anyway?

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  13. Teena

    Assalamu Alaikom, that’s the problem with the organization here in Houston. I think things are going to change soon insha’Allah. Most of the shiekhs want to get the “politicians” out of the administration. I believe because I have been told by someone close to a candidate that some of them do not even pray 5 times a day! And they’re telling our Sheyookh (sp?) what to do! I told my husband that we need to get Yasir Qadhi to run for President of ISGH! He would win hands down, but I guess he’s probably too busy right now. The whole system needs to be changed and we need to get somebody who is knowledgeable and religious into these offices, not just some rich guys who get all their friends to vote for them! (because you have to pay a $40.00 membership fee if you want to have voting priveleges.) It’s crazy!

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  14. moiez

    Oh boy don’t even get me started on board members we dot need them what we need is an imam who takes care of deen and politics sort of like a calipha and if he needs a deputy he appoints a young knowledgable person.
    Like Musa (as) and Harun (as) like Rasulallah (S) and Abu Bakr (ra) and Umar (ra) and they run the Masjid on something called ummm sunnah

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  15. Ruth Nasrullah

    Asalaamu alaikum, nuqtah. Re your comments:

    “Of course there may be cultural reasons behind how people behave or act. But, why is the solution always,’ they need a lesson in (western) democracy?’ I mean are these people inherently incapable of acting appropriately? And what did that ’shaykh’ mean by ‘democracy’ anyway?”

    I won’t speak for the sheikh (he is in fact a sheikh, not sure why you put that in quotation marks) but I don’t think anything as broad as western democracy versus sharia-based government was meant, and that’s not what I meant by bringing it up.

    Growing up in America I was taught that the way people should behave is to give everyone a chance to speak, decide by majority vote and treat each other fairly. I’m not talking about formal government, but rather what my culture taught me, right or wrong. The necessity of fairness is one of the things that defines American culture.

    The sad thing is that I’m not even sure what the proper Islamic guidelines are for a masjid governing body to conduct business. I just know that the model can’t be the ugliness I see.

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  16. Faiez

    Awesome story, masha’Allah. You can really see the difference when an individual with knowledge of this Deen is a leader vs. individuals who are leaders but do not have much knowledge.

    “My theory is “let them die out, then take over”.”

    haha, how many times has that rattled through my head…

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  17. Siraaj Muhammad

    There have been a lot of responses which say, “We hate them, they suck, etc,” and trying to analyze what can be done to change THEM.

    At the end of the day, you should say, what can I personally do to progress this situation in a different direction.

    Complain on blog? Ok, that spreads awareness. Someone noted that there are fees for joining and voting. In our MSA, when ignorant people tried to pay up and take over, we anticipated, campaigned, and put the right people in power (yeah, we paid for our voters as well ;)).

    Long story short, if you really care about your masjid, and you think you know who needs to lead, then voting out the masjid board is not all that big a deal. Most people don’t care about masjid membership anyway, and the current boad in most masjids can very easily be overthrown.

    Except that if it did happen, no one would know what to do after that. Yay, we have the masjid – now what? Oh yeah, the guys with all the money who built the masjid – they’re gone, they’re donating anymore, and now you have to spend your time fundraising for monthly bills. Have fun!

    So before the complaints come in about one aspect (and a serious one, no doubt), start asking yourselves, does the leadership exist that no only looks after the religious aspect of the community, but the logistical sustainability of the building itself.

    If the leadership is somewhat non-practicing, but the building still stands, that may be better than good practicing Muslims who don’t know a thing about running a masjid. It’s something that each masjid needs to look at.

    Siraaj

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  18. Faiez

    “voting out the masjid board is not all that big a deal. ”

    Unless, of course, the board isn’t voted in.

    “If the leadership is somewhat non-practicing, but the building still stands, that may be better than good practicing Muslims who don’t know a thing about running a masjid. It’s something that each masjid needs to look at.”

    That’s why we need good practicing Muslims who know how to run businesses to run these masaajid. It’s easy to stereotype that practicing Muslims don’t know how to run Masaajid.

    “At the end of the day, you should say, what can I personally do to progress this situation in a different direction.”

    Excellent point.

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  19. Siraaj Muhammad

    Bro, it’s not a stereotype – it’s a reality. Take a look in our own community at what happens to the majority of religious-minded kids after they graduate college and get married.

    Most who were in any way active disappear. Family gatherings, family gatherings, and oh yeah, family gatherings. And then, you find a few who are active after marriage, but now ask, how many are really leaders, and can manage as well?

    The crickets start chirping.

    For myself, I feel the best way I can contribute is continual self development, not just in Islamic knowledge, but in my knowledge of communication, business, politics, leadership, etc and putting that knowledge to use within the community wherever it makes sense.

    I think a lot of us need to stop pointing the finger at what’s wrong “out there” and starting pointing a finger at ourselves and asking, “How do I get involved to solve this?” and not thinking this is something that will happen in the next 2 or 3 years, but 20 – 25 years, insha’Allah.

    In the end, we’re all responsible, and no amount of fingerpointing at the masjid board will justify a lack of initiative from one’s own self.

    Siraaj

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  20. Ruth Nasrullah

    Asalaamu alaikum.

    What is the Islamic way of getting people on and off governing boards?

    What do you do in a system where there aren’t nominated candidates who campaign to the voting public and then the “best man wins”? What do you do in a system where behind the scenes people negotiate and pressure others to drop out as nominees, so then there is only one candidate? And in that system no one is allowed inside the masjid to campaign or mention their intention to run? Is that the Islamic way? This is a serious question I’m asking because I literally don’t know the answer.

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  21. Siraaj Muhammad

    I’d say before thinking about overturning the system as it stands on its head, think about all the things you would like to change or accomplish. Do you know what it is, how it would look like, who would maintain it, the resources to keep it going and not fizzle out, etc.

    Once you have a clear picture of what you want to do, now ask yourself, do I need to be on the masjid board to effect this change? If not, look into those alternatives because remember, being on masjid board is not the goal – it’s simply a means to another set of goals you have in mind.

    At our masjid, we have the same issue of not knowing who the board is or what they do, but we don’t have elections, and we have a knowledgable imam who is good for the community, and generally speaking, the board does not interfere when we do different events and programs in the masjid, so it’s not in my personal best interests to take over and do work such as trying to raise, in our case, $5 million / year to take care of operating costs, or fundraising for the Islamic school building expansion.

    If you still feel that you want or need to get involved at the board level, then you’ll first need to develop influence in the community on a day-to-day basis. You have to give of yourself and show commitment to the well-being of the community. Do it for the sake of Allah subhaana wa ta’aala, and when obstacles come in the way, do not become upset, angry, and start talking badly about people who may be the source of the problem. Simply smile, and keep going. Your circle of influence will grow over time and as people see your sincerity and hardwork, they will naturally incline towards you. It won’t be long before someone suggests you run for a position. That is how you “campaign” – with your actions and reputation which is built up over time. It requires patience and dedication.

    As for unscrupulous board members, if your influence is built up well enough, dealing with them is not that big a deal. With strong community influence (built up grassroots), you can bring in the votes needed to take the position you’d like. I’d say though, spend your time observing the system inside and out. Become a paid member, attend all the meetings, look for weaknesses not in the people, but in the system itself. If in the whole community 30 people on average pay to be on the board, then you’ll need 40 people to pay to vote you in. Save the money, and pay for those you have influence over who don’t have the inclination to normally participate. This is an example, the point being, look for those weaknesses, understand it, and bring it to your advantage.

    Having said all that, one alternative to all the masjid politicking is to bring yourself and a group of like-minded individuals who have some sort of program, activity, or policy you’d like implemented, and ask the board politely if you can form a sub-committee regarding that issue as there are many concerned community members regarding that issue.

    These are just a few ideas. A good book to pick up on leadership and influence, and so forth would be any book John Maxwell has written on leadership and Dr. Robert Cialdini’s “Influence”. Books such as those will give you a general framework for understanding the tools at your disposal to lead and make a change, and you can decide what tools are best to use in your situation, insha’Allah.

    Siraaj

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  22. Ruth Nasrullah

    Salaams, siraaj – not sure if your comments were in response to my post, but thanks for the advice. I’m actually on the governing council of my masjid and as far as I know I have a fair amount of respect in the masjid community already.

    As I said, my question wasn’t rhetorical, but literal – how should the governing body of a masjid be formed Islamically?

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  23. Siraaj Muhammad

    One other comment, regarding the best “Islamic System” to run a masjid, from what I have seen and heard from other shuyookh, the idea of a democratically elected board to run the operations of the masjid is fine, and consensus can be reached on matters of procedure and rules within the community, so I don’t see a problem with the system itself.

    I think the disagreement many are having is with the people in the system, and their lack of religious education, which translates into poor decisions and poor interaction with other board members.

    Check with your local shaykh about your local masjid’s system to be 100% sure, though.

    Siraaj

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  24. Siraaj Muhammad

    “Salaams, siraaj – not sure if your comments were in response to my post, but thanks for the advice. I’m actually on the governing council of my masjid and as far as I know I have a fair amount of respect in the masjid community already.”

    It was in response to what you had specifically mentioned, and I misunderstood your community position.

    Regarding actual campaigning, I can’t give you a fatwa and say yay or nay as to whether it’s allowed or not. From personal experience, I can say that in the minds of most people I’ve dealt with, campaigning for a position translates into insincerity for them because we tend to associate campaigning with American politicians who also have a stereotype of corruption, nepotism, powermongering, serving corporate/special interests, etc. It’s also been my experience that the ones campaigning tend to be the insincere ones, so even if someone sincerely wanted to just help the community, those motives would come into question for some who have had experience with previous bad examples.

    Siraaj

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  25. jinnzaman

    Assalamu alaikum

    Excellent article.

    Unfortunately, the general rule for the American Muslim community seems to be that fitnah will exist in our masajid and the good well maintained masjid is the exception.

    One thing I’ve noticed about those masajid that are well-organized and free from fitnah is that they usually have a scholar who is involved in the decision making process and fiqh issues are referred to him or other ‘Ulema as opposed to lay people making up their own opinions.

    If you don’t mind, I’m going to link this post on my blog. :)

    masalama

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  26. Faiez

    “At our masjid…generally speaking, the board does not interfere when we do different events and programs in the masjid”

    Not true.

    I honestly believe that raising the money for a Masjid’s running expenses isn’t a big deal so long as the leader knows the right people in the community. Simple example of that is the masjid that I go to, the board has it’s differences, but the Ameer is a knowledgable individual who knows how to call the shots and deal with his people. The fact that he has the knowledge really helps because he instigates the proper programs for the community. Not to mention the fact that after almost 10-15 years of debating and chaat masala, he was the only leader able to unite the community to buy an actual new masjid by the Will of Allah (swt). The community had literally been in stand still over getting a new property and have been fighting over little things for so long, yet, when he came into ‘ameership’ it made a huge difference in such a short amount of time. The community is finally starting become a bit more healthy and united as result of this work, waAlhumdulilah.

    The leadership has a lot to do with what programs that a community does and which direction the community is taken. No matter how many rogue programs you’ll try to make in the masjid, eventually someone will find that you are doing it and want it to be centralized to the masjid. If it gets centralized to the masjid then the board has a say as to what happens and we get stuck back in the loop. In my limited useless experience, I’ve noticed that the masaajid that have centralized programs are usually more successful than the masaajid that have various groups coming and making their own programs. But of course, since the board might be corrupt, the centralized programs are corrupt. So if you have a better board, you have a better program. This is what I’ve seen.

    You can theorize about how to ‘take over’ the board or how to get onto the board and you maybe right OR wrong. But at the end of the day a knowedgeable board beats and unknowledgeable board hands down because it will lead to the embetterment of the community as a whole.

    wa Allahu ‘Alam

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  27. Tameem

    WS wr wb,
    some good responses mashallah!
    theres a masjid by me and theres no silly commitee business …and mashalla the youth generallyrun the mosque and subhanallah i tell its got such a nice , warm atmosphere!
    so youth out there REBELLL!
    no no only joking…
    WSWRwB

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  28. Tameem

    salaam,
    oh brother fiez, ..’let them die out..” aah i have the same idea!
    ws

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  29. Siraaj Muhammad

    “You can theorize about how to ‘take over’ the board or how to get onto the board and you maybe right OR wrong. But at the end of the day a knowedgeable board beats and unknowledgeable board hands down because it will lead to the embetterment of the community as a whole.”

    Your example doesn’t translate into your conclusion. Imran Baig isn’t just knowledgable – he’s a competent leader and manager. The proof of that is that he’s not only dedicated to helping run the community, he runs the Sunday school at CPSA and balances family responsibilities and is a full-time professional. And that’s pretty much what I mentioned earlier – you really don’t find many, or any people like this, who are both competent (leaders and managers) and religious.

    My point is simply that a group of practicing Muslims who are incompetent leaders is in all likelihood not going to be better than competent non-practicing Muslims in running the masjid. Many are the poorly organized and now broken daw’ah projects that stand as testaments to this.

    And so, before everyone complains and gets in a huff about the board, I’m saying all the religious minded people need to learn to get themselves involved in their communities, deeply involved, constantly working different projects, working with people, reading books and learning, gaining as much experience and knowledge as possible before talking.

    The best leadership model I’ve seen in Chicago comes from Orland Park’s masjid – competent leadership from practicing brothers who have been involved both in their communities and knew the elders well as well as getting themselves involved in their MSAs, and work professionally, and are managing all of it really well.

    Of course, they’re Arab and maybe they have less family parties to attend =D

    Siraaj

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  30. Faiez

    “Your example doesn’t translate into your conclusion.”

    There were many leaders before him who were businessmen and true leaders (in other aspects of their da’wah) but weren’t able to produce the results he was able to produce. That was my point. I’m not negating that the we should throw any Yusuf with knowledge into the board. Of course they would have to have some sort of leadership skills, but at the end of the day, the people of knowledge always end up better than the ones who aren’t. And I personally would take a person who doesn’t know much about leadership but is knowledgeable over someone who is not knowledgeable but is a leader. Because the one who is knowledgeable in his deen will put his utmost effort into the community and figuring out what needs to be done to make it better and will eventually acquire the traits he needs in order for him to be the leader that drives the community forward at a much more efficient pace than when he first started. That’s self evident in my example (Know your people before you speak about them).

    And with that, this is probably the longest discussion I’ve had on a blog in my life.

    Asalaamu alaikum

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  31. Siraaj Muhammad

    Walaykum as salaam,

    Sorry bro, that last post flew over my head. Can you clarify the first statement about the “leaders before him who were businessmen and true leaders (in other aspects of their daw’ah)”…? Maybe some details?

    Siraaj

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