These are cheap shots from administration to get the attention of people diverted from the problems they are facing, and also to justify patriot act, which was in jeopardy.

When Patriot act came to effect, many ordinary americans thought it would be focusing on terrorist, I like many other muslims just felt it would be witch hunt against muslims and is racial profiling. Very few people, (among them Ron Paul, and Russ Feingold) objected to it. And it turned out patriot act was used for political agenda of Bush as well as faking progress against war on terrorism.

This is strange way to win the war on terror. I mean do people in government really think this would make America safer? Should not they be spending time to stop actual terror plot rather than instigate people to create plot then foil it? Instead of instigating non-violent people to become violent, should not they be spending time to pacify violent people to become non-violent? The day is night and the night is day.

Good posting Amad.

Any case of an easily misled Muslim who does something illegal becomes a generic “Muslim” problem.

And if someone is hell-bent on showing a generic “Muslim” problem all they would need to do would be to find Muslims who can be easily misled.

This is becoming an impossible problem to resolve for Muslims though.

If were able to educate our all our dispersed Ummah in the west not to react to anything, then we would make them eunuchs and slaves to the murderous foreign policies of the west. And if we don’t do anything then those who want to find the Muslims that can be easily misled will have an easy job.

It’s getting out of this catch 22 situation that is the conundrum for the Ummah.

I am sure everyone will have noticed the blatant Islamophobes who have woken up globally to live their fantasy dream of a new kind of a crusade. They are being given prominence by the media. Infact certain media outlets have become the vanguards of Islamophobia.

The attacks on Muslims by the media are a constant trickle of filth. These attacks are tools that are used by the cabalists to perform their false flag attacks. But in order to perform the attacks they need some vulnerable Muslims.

Ok, so we need to find a way to pinpoint and educate the vulnerable Muslims, but we need to bring the media to accountability too. After all the mainstream media is pouring their messages of hate into everyone’s brains day in day out.

Asalaamu alaikum, there are so many truths in this article.

Keeping an eye on white racists is something ADL does pretty well. And they take donations from everybody!

DrM! I wondered where you had gone to. I admit to missing you terribly over at altmuslim.com. No one had more creative and enjoyable invective than you did! (But where did “muslim hating” come from?)

(Small correction: I’m not solomonia)

“Jewish terror”? Definitions and examples, please, along with explanations of why such activities are morally wrong. Or is this the wrong venue for such a discussion? I’ve already been accused of being a troll here once, and I don’t want to be thought of that way.

The folks at CAIR may have had in mind ADL’s filings of amicus briefs like this one on behalf of detained Muslims.

I think the Houston chapter was pretty good and worked with CAIR in civil-rights work.

The folks at CAIR may have had ADL’s filings of amicus briefs on behalf of Muslim detainees in mind.

DrM: mixing up ADL and AIPAC is almost like mixing oil and water. ADL concentrates on domestic U.S. stuff, expecially the white supremacists which prompted their founding; AIPAC is concerned about Israel.

Amad, it’s simply that there isn’t any evidence there for us ordinary folk to examine to support the tale of an anonymous eyewitness. Many journalists would not have propagated it unless they could have found a minimum of two eyewitnesses, even anonymous ones. Most would not have published a second-hand account attributed to an anonymous eyewitness at all. Librescu’s deeds were witnessed by several of his students, some of whom have chosen not to remain anonymous, so I never considered investigating further.

(Why did I post it at altmuslim.com? Consider what the author of the altmuslim.com article does for a living.)

No, I didn’t know Sidkey spoke to the eyewitness. Can you direct me further, please? Nothing pops up on Google. I may modify my blog post and altmuslim.com comments based on new information.

On the larger issue, do you agree that a story falsely making someone out as a hero and attributing his fictional deeds to his religion is a form of blasphemy?

(Why tar me with the zionist-believes-everything-about-muslims-is-bad brush? How can you make such sweeping judgments about me? In childhood, it was my Muslim next-door neighbors who taught me, by example, how to carry myself like a gentleman.)

As-salaamu ‘alaikum Amad:

I wanted to bring up a couple of points. And please let me know what you think.

First of all the six brothers who were “allegedly” trying to do an operation against armed combatants on a military base is A LOT better then what MANY, MANY Muslims, although a small, insha’Allah, but very vocal minority, say, preach, and believe wholeheartedly should be done as far as noncombatant (civilian) kuffar are concerned. While I agree that the US authorities likely have used this incident to further their own interests and propaganda about the so-called “war on terror,” it seems that many of the posters here are insinuating that the US authorities were in essence “lying” about the alleged plans, and that no Muslim in the US would not want to do an operation like this, or one MUCH worse Islamically, and considered haraam, for example, a Madrid bombings type of operation slaughtering scores of noncombatant kuffar.

IMHO, many of us seem to not be objectively looking into our situation whether in Western countries or Muslim countries, and seem to show a lot of BLIND denial and extreme indifference about what many of our brothers/sisters truly believe in.

Who is the most popular Muslim in the world today, and even America? Allahu alam, but IMHO of course it is “Shaykh” Osama. Go to any masjid in North America, and Allahu alam, and hopefully I’m wrong, but I believe that if we could honestly ask the brothers and sisters if they “love” Osama without worrying that our questions would be recorded by the undercover wire taps already in “many” of our masajid, or the fact that the shuyukh as well as the brothers/sisters there would think that you were a spy for asking this (and rightly so in today’s climate), I believe that most of the brothers and sisters would say that they truly love Osama. (Now, whether they believe that he or al-Qaeda was responsible for the 911 attacks is another story, as it seems that that this is another topic for another time, but obviously many of our brothers and sisters believe that the “zionists” or the Mossad carried out the attacks)

I don’t know about other Muslims, but I personally find it extremely sad and depressing that so many of us here (and not just oversees) seem to blindly love and support “Shaykh” Osama and at least to a lesser extent al-Qaeda’s type of “ideology” — saying it is permissible, heck it is REALLY great, and REALLY excellent Islamically, to slaughter and kill as many noncombatant (civilian) kuffar as possible.

wa salaam

As salaamu ‘alaikum Amad:

“Wow, are you REAL, “a brother”?? Where did you get your talking points from? Jihadwatch or LGF?”

First of all brother, let me say that I’m sorry to have offended you or anyone else reading what I posted, and more importantly I ask Allah ‘azza wa jall for forgiveness if I said anything hurtful or upsetting.

Yes, brother, I’m tying to at least “keep it real” as a brother, insha’Allah. I do try to stay away from these hate-mongering, bigoted, Islamiphobic websites as much as I can, but I think that they basically say that MOST, if not all Muslims are evil, sadistic, subhuman, devious “terrorists,” that support any, and all terror acts, ostensibly done “in the name” of Islam. (i.e., the killing of non-Muslim noncombatants) Of course, I NEVER said this brother. I said that a small, but vocal minority of Muslims seem to support these very unIslamic types of acts. This was only my opinion, nothing more and nothing less, and I definitely should have said that of course Allah (swt) knows best. What is your opinion brother? Regardless of how you feel, I will see that as your opinion, and respect it, insha’Allah.

“First of all, you make wild speculations and judgements about our ‘love’ for Osama… and then based on this false premise, you go on and make a conclusion that it is sad to see that so many of us love him?? Do you even know how to make an effective argument?”

In retrospect, I probably should have said that “some” or “many” Muslims (at least in America) love Osama, as opposed to most (as this would mean at least 51%), and this would IMHO, probably be more accurate, but Allahu alam, although I did say that I hoped that I was wrong about my opinion/conclusion. And of course I NEVER said that I based my opinions on “scientific research.” In fact this is why I wanted to get your feedback and perspective from you and other posters.

“Which Masjid or people do you hang out with? IF indeed you do hang out with Muslims. I mean, I have rarely, if ever, heard of anyone supporting, let alone loving Osama. What you have said is completely incredulous, including being completely speculative in nature. Do you have ANY evidence for what you stated? I bet not, and when you get some, then please do share it.”

Yes, I do hang out, and associate with Muslims. The masajid that I go to, or the places I hangout at are just that — places that “I” go to and hangout, and hence, these are only of course my experiences. And again brother, I never said that I conducted scientific research, nor did I say that I had the total, 100% “absolute,” etched in stone, “truth.” And yes, I have talked to brothers, whether in the masjid setting, or outside of this environment, that say that yes, they do “love” Osama. However, they didn’t necessarily believe that he or al-Qaeda, was responsible for the 911 attack (and Allahu alam), but pretty much seemed to believe that either the US govt., the zionists/Israelis, or a combination of them were the ones responsible. Again, I don’t have scientific evidence, or “proof” and this was only my personal experience, nothing more and nothing less.

There is another dynamic into how I have formulated my opinions, aside from face to face talks with various brothers. I have visited many, many Islamic blogs, and forums, and sites, and have debated from time to time with some of the brothers (and sisters) on these blogs about their “extremist” opinions and why they feel this way (condoning, defending, and promoting this “extremist” ideology of the killing of non-Muslim noncombatants, and calling this “halaal,” good for Muslims, etc.) If you and the administrators of this site want me to, I can make another post with links to, or addresses of their blogs. I wouldn’t want to give these brothers and sisters the publicity, as I and the vast majority of Muslims, except for a very vocal minority (as I articulated in my first post) do not at all agree with this kind of extremist “ideology.” Again, this was one of the main reasons that I posted what I posted, because YES, wallahi, this kind of thinking amongst a minority of Muslims is indeed VERY depressing, and sad to me. How do you feel akhee? Do you get upset, or angry, or frustrated, or depressed at times that there are these knuckle-heads out there that feel this way?

“What you are saying is no different from the Islamaphobic enemies of Muslims who insist that there are no ‘moderate’ Muslims. If you really feel that way, then you should get a ticket on Spencer’s bus. But next time you wish to comment on MM, you better be prepared to back your statements with evidence, not hearsay. Otherwise, your comments will go where they deserve, the TRASH bin.”

I again apologize to you and anyone that was offended by my post, and of course ask Allah (swt) for His forgiveness. I only made my post for the sake of Allah (swt), period. And wallahi, I truly believe that various Muslims who have these extremist, misguided ideologies, are doing more harm than anything I could ever post. I believe that you were being unfair to me as a Muslim brother, calling me the same, or lumping me in with these hateful, bigoted, hate-mongering Islamiphobes, telling me to “get a ticket on the bus” with a very known Islam hating, bigoted, pro-genocical kaafir. SubhanAllah.

You are entitled to your opinion though, and I respect it, and again, please accept my apologies.

Peace brother

Amad:

I don’t understand what you are trying to get at with attributing deeds to his religion? We didn’t attribute anything to anyone’s religion.

No one at MM, but Dr. H.H. over at altmuslim.com did. I think a number of Arab newspapers and bloggers did, too. I am not tarring you or anyone else here with the same brush, am I?

Also, I didn’t find the interview you quoted here at MM. Can you give me the link?

what do YOU or anyone else gain by trying to debunk the heroism thing?

If I was just trying to “debunk the heroism thing” I wouldn’t have waited weeks to post about it, would I? You don’t think my perceived empathy with Waleed – that he would prefer what truth exists be confirmed and told – sufficient motivation?

The actions of the Jewish professor were clearly deliberate and witnessed by many. What Waleed did, at most, was a twitch, and there is no evidence available to support even that. The angst of Holocaust survivorship as motivation for great deeds is well known, as Israel’s establishment by many deeds of courage and self-sacrifice in the face of superior Arab armies demonstrated. As a non-Muslim engineering student who partnered with a Muslim graduate student, I am not at all convinced that Islam shaped Waleed’s character enough for me to be so certain as of his motivations.

The story of Waleed’s heroism may be entirely false, from beginning to end, and may exist only to promote Islam. Isn’t that blasphemy? That’s the key difference in the two stories.

Not even the anonymous witness can be absolutely certain that it was deliberate. Yet I am prepared to accept the story of Waleed’s heroism – and even spread it further – if (1) the anonymous witness steps forward, and (2) the autopsy report supports the story, or at least doesn’t definitively dispute it (presumably the family can sign a waiver for its release). Don’t you think Waleed’s stature – and that of Arabs and Muslims too, perhaps – would only be enhanced if these things happened?

your blog has enough reasons for me to question your motives. Just like if we started investigating the heroism of an atheist

Ah, yes, the conviction that truth is established by motives and character of the bearer. Facts are secondary, because their verity can’t always be ascertained. I understand that hadiths are evaluated the same way, is that correct?

A Brother, I meant Ed Hussain or what ever that joker calls himself. You know the one I mean – the facist thug who is now wooing the orientalists with his new book, “the islamist”.

Judge Dredd:

You seem to be insinuating that because as a Muslim I have spoken out, criticized, pointed out munkar, etc., for the sake of Allah (swt) against, IMHO, what I feel are severely misguided, extremists who distort, twist, and pervert the beautiful Deen of Allah (swt) — that it is very wrong, unIslamic, traitorous, and tantamount of being equal to that of an apparent munafiq (the “Ed” Hussein character) — a so-called Muslim who has apparently taken tawagheet kuffar, and/or the enemies of Allah (swt) as auliya (protectors), who Allahu ‘alam, is at best a “fasiq,” and at worse a “murtad.” (and if true, Allah’s (swt) punishment of death would be incumbent on) SubhanAllah. Please learn some Islamic adab, insha’Allah.

Allah (swt) says in the Qur’an (interpretation of the meaning):

[4:135] O you who believe! be maintainers of justice, bearers of witness of Allah’s sake, though it may be against your own selves or (your) parents or near relatives; if he be rich or poor, Allah is nearer to them both in compassion; therefore do not follow (your) low desires, lest you deviate; and if you swerve or turn aside, then surely Allah is aware of what you do.

[3:104] And there may spring from you a nation who invite to goodness, and enjoin right conduct and forbid indecency. Such are they who are successful.

[3:110] Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in God. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors.

[5:008] O you who believe! Stand out firmly for Allah and be just witnesses and let not the enmity and hatred of others make you avoid justice. Be just: that is nearer to piety, and fear Allah. Verily, Allah is Well Acquainted with what you do.

Also, here are some ahadith of the Rasool (saw) on some of the principles of enjoining good and forbidding evil, and speaking the truth:

On the authority of Abu Sa`id (radhiallahu `anhu) that the Prophet sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam said, “Whoever sees something evil should change it with his hand. If he cannot, then with his tongue; and if he cannot do even that, then in his heart. That is the weakest degree of faith.” (Muslim)

He also relates on the authority of Ibn Mas`ud that the Prophet (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) said, “There was not a single Prophet among those who were sent before me who did not have apostles and companions and followed his Sunna and obeyed his commands. But afterwards other generations came whose words belied their deeds, and whose deeds were not in accordance with what they commanded others to do. Whoever struggles against the with his hand is a believer. Whoever struggles against them with his tongue is a believer. And whoever struggles against them with his heart is a believer. But when none of these things are done, then not a single mustard’s seed weight of faith is present.” (Muslim)

Zaynab (radhiallahu `anha), the wife of the Prophet (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) said, “The Prophet (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) once awoke, and his face was dark, as he said three times, ‘There is no deity worthy of worship but Allah! Woe betide the Arabs, because of an evil which will soon come! Today, the barrier of Juj and Ma`juj has been breached by so much,’ and he made a circle with his thumb and forefinger.” And Zaynab remarked, “I said, ‘O Messenger of Allah! Even when the righteous still dwell amongst us?’ and he said, ‘Yes, when khubth (moral degradation) becomes widespread.’”

Malik Ibn Dinar once recited the verse, There were in the city nine men who caused corruption in the earth, and would not cause reform, [27:48] and said, “Nowadays, there are people in every clan and district who cause corruption in the earth, and do not cause reform.”

He also said, “We have become accustomed to loving the world, so that we do not enjoin good or forbid evil to one another. Allah the Most High will certainly not permit us to continue doing this, but would that I knew what kind of punishment shall befall us!”

`Umar ibn `Abdul `Aziz said, “It used to be that Allah the Most High does not punish the common people for the sins of the elite; but when the evil is done openly, and they do not repudiate it, they all become deserving of His punishment.” (Bukhari and Muslim)

The Prophet said, “Enjoining all that is good is a Sadaqa.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari 8.50, Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah)

The Prophet (saw) said: If the people see an evil and they do not change it, soon Allah will inflict them all with His Punishment. (Ahmed, graded authentic by Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’ (1/398))

solomon2, vice versa….

….no seriously, yawn.

JD: First, I’d like to thank you for providing the reference for the hadith you quoted. No one has ever done that for me before. I appreciate the courtesy. Do you understand now why so many non-Muslims think Islam consists of things pulled out of the air for the convenience of whoever is quoting it?

Second, a question: How do you recognize evil? That question must be dealt with before one can formulate the questions you just posed to me.

Education for Solomon2

See the PURE EVIL:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPdj9LAB0as&mode=related&search=

for all to see.

Solomon2: “You have diminished my good will somewhat by this waste of time. Please be more precise in your “educational” efforts; you can’t just say, “read the Koran” or “watch this video”. As an example, and in part response, I offer my post, Why Israel Tolerates Arabs for consideration.”

Solomon2, Goodwill in the form of denial and rebuttal must be typical of the Israeli definition of Goodwill in the face of Israeli attrocities. The fact that Israelis have stolen the Palestinians land is an EVIL crime in itself let alone fastforwarding to these video clips. Your shortcoming is that you cannot see any crimes committed by your people.
What is the definition of NO goodwill?
behaviour that is demonic?

JD:

1) I was discussing my “goodwill” as in being willing to spend time on this conversation. We have to be specific or risk misinterpretation. Agreement, denial, and rebuttal are normal components of any argument, as anyone styling himself a “judge” should know.

2) The fact that Israelis have stolen the Palestinians land is an EVIL crime in itself.

Ah, specifics. But what is “EVIL”? Do you consider the Muslim Conquest of the Mediterranean, Persia, Mesopotamia, and India an “EVIL crime in itself” as well?

Asalaamu alaikum.

When I started my Chronicle blog, one of the first things the editor advised me was “Don’t feed the trolls.” There are some debates that are worthwhile and some that will go on endlessly without resolution because the only point is to argue. This is one of the latter.

So, do you not think that for Israelis to show they are GOOD people, and they care for an area they have plagued with misery, they should not just get up and leave?

Like how the Israelis got up and left Gaza, is that what you mean? There were many debates about where to establish a Jewish state at the beginning of the Zionist movement. The Ottomans offerred Mesopotamia and were rejected. The Brits offerred beautiful Uganda and that was taken very seriously, but the ultimate decision was that the only region of the world the Jews has a historical claim to their own state was Palestine. Immigration began as a trickle, as only the worst land was for sale, and swamps had to be drained and deserts recontoured for agriculture. Then the Brits issued the Balfour Declaration. seeking in exchange that the Jews would join the British, Arabs, and Kurds in the battle to free the middle east from Ottoman domination and give Arabs, Jews, and Kurds alike a chance for self-rule. The Kurds got shafted, and the land promised to the Jews was later reduced by two-thirds.

The Holocaust made the creation of Israel an imperative, but did not alter the substance of the bargain. Why, then, do you call upon the Israelis to show further goodwill – and this time by departing the region entirely? Is that not an EVIL impulse on your part?

Amad,

I had a brief look at the youtube film linked in your posting. It looks really good. I didnt have time today, but will snuggle up later on the sofa and watch it.

Thanks for posting the link.